What is the strangest thing you believe to be true?

Posted by Spocko on Wednesday, September 27, 2006 at 06:47 AM. Read 4372 times. Tags:
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The guys at MemeTherapy have been running a series of interesting threads about Strange Beliefs over the last few weeks. It’s a fun read. I thought the kind folks here at the Bastard’s might like to give it a try.

Their question:
“What is the strangest thing you believe to be true?”

My response…

At first glance this question appears simple enough. I can think of many fascinating subjects I have read about over the years; nanotech, “gray goo”, 11-dimensional space, relativity, the possibility of time travel, quantum entanglement, wave particle duality, virtual reality. There flows a never ending stream of ideas that wells up from the spring that is the Mind of Man. I could have selected any item from this list, or more, and would have provided a reasonably interesting response. How does one choose from such a fantastical array of knowledge? Technology can indeed appear strange or magical to one unfamiliar with a particular field of study. Some feel that medical wonders, from stem-cell research and genetic engineering to face transplants, are the definition of the word “strange”. Others may perceive the political and ideological mindset of their “enemies” to be the pinnacle of the eldritch.

But to ask an atheist what he “believes” to be true introduces quite a different “texture” to the question posed. The meaning of the word “believe” may easily be misconstrued. I am often bewildered by the multiple usage of some words from the English language. To some, “belief” is only given to that which has overwhelming evidence to support it, such evidence that there is no point to even use the word “believe”. Does one say: “I believe the sky is blue”? No. We say: “The sky is blue”. We can test this statement through many types of observation, experimentation, and verification. We know the sky is blue. Some use the word “believe” in the same manner that they use the word “think”, e.g. “I believe I’ll have another beer!” - the two words are interchangeable here. Then we come, of course, to the most common meaning of the word “believe”, that equivalent to “faith”; acceptance of a proposition without any need, or desire, for supporting evidence whatsoever.

I avoid the use of the words “believe” and “belief” because of their imprecise usage. There are, however, certain words I’ll use in spite of their misuse. For example, I have no qualms stating that I’m an “atheist” even though that word has been intentionally misused and demonized, perhaps since its inception. An atheist is simply one who does not believe. To be an atheist one need only answer “no” to the question “Do you believe [in god(s)]?” No further assertion is made.

I prefer to use the verb “know” instead of “believe” and, like Great Lady Science, accept that knowledge can be transitory and must evolve as new evidence is discovered. Ironically, my answer to the question “What is the strangest thing you know to be true?” would bring me back to the issue of faith.

The strangest thing I know of is the ability of the human mind to accept the most incredible of statements by the simple application of the magic word “faith”. How is it that, in the 21st century, we still have people that believe the world is only 6000 years old in light of the evidence from various fields of science in support of its vastly older age? How can one ignore mounds of fossil evidence for the progression of evolution and only see the “gaps”. What is it that allows the brilliant scientist who, otherwise, demands empirical data to advance his theories, to assert that there is a god when no one has presented any evidence to corroborate the existence of said deity? Is it a mental blind spot, a type of intellectual laziness used to avoid investigating fully the reason one believes one fable over another?

This strange thing called faith intrigues me. I have studied several of the mythologies of various civilizations throughout history and I find the subject fascinating. The majority of us appear to be so desperate for answers that we will accept any concept of reality that we are subjected to at an early age. We indoctrinate our children into a system of thought handed down by our progenitors and our children will usually teach their own children the same vision; the meme propagates. The evolution of religion presents the prime example of this strange ability to close the mind to healthy skepticism and reason. I wonder if we have herein evidence for the existence of a parasitic meme, one that propagates from the pulpit and lives in symbiosis with those that hunger for its anesthetic affects.

I look forward to a future where such strange ideas as faith and belief have faded into obscurity and disrepute as have the gods of old. A future where the unknown is regarded as an opportunity, not an enemy to be feared and obscured by the blinders of myth.

What’s the strangest thing you “believe”?

Comments:

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Sadie Jane United States Posted on 09/28/2006 at 01:24 AM

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Consi: Proof that even in the craziest of humans there are redeeming qualities to be found.

Many people regarded the late Hunter S. Thompson as one of the craziest of humans. I regarded him as one of the most ingenious and creative.

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Thinking is the best way to travel.

zilch Austria Posted on 09/28/2006 at 02:50 AM

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LJ, Sadie, KPG, Webs- believe it or not, when I wrote my first post here, I considered saying that the strangest thing I believed to be true is that music from the 60’s was better than most music today.  Now is that a strange coincidence, or what?

Of course, a lot of music from the 50’s was good too: Dufay, Binchois, Ockeghem… Naturally, I mean the 1450’s. LOL

Webs: glad to hear you’ve seen through the conspiracy crap.  It is enticing, or it wouldn’t have followers.  But it is indeed crap.  I’ve been chatting up the guys at the Bible Code site, because I’m curious how people can get sucked into such self-evidently ridiculous beliefs.  At least one of them not only believes that 9/11 was an inside job, but is also a Holocaust denier, along with believing all this Bible code crap with the Illuminati and whatnot.  Turns out, though, that for him, what actually happened is secondary:  the important thing is that the Devil is behind it all, and we have to properly interpret the Bible to find out what we should do, and what’s going to happen next.  Rational thinking is not only in short supply among these guys, but it is disdained as a waste of time.

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You were born.  And so you’re free.  So happy birthday.
- Laurie Anderson

Brooks United States Posted on 09/28/2006 at 03:06 AM

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In the 70’s I thought 70’s music was the best. In the 80’s I thought 80’s music was the best. In the 90’s I thought 90’s music was the best. See a pattern here? No one can ever accuse me of being stuck in the past. That doesn’t mean that I don’t love and appreciate The Doors either. Now I’m not an old guy at 42, but to say that music today just sucks is as closed minded as can be, something I wouldn’t expect from this crowd. grin Every decade has it’s shitty music, but if you don’t look deeper, then you’re missing out.

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DWangerin United States Posted on 09/28/2006 at 03:18 AM

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I strongly believe in the existence of aliens, although I doubt that they have ever visited the earth (so perhaps it would be more accurate to say that I believe in extra-terrestrial life elsewhere in the universe).

From our understandings of the history of life on our own planet, it appears that primitive life formed, was completely destroyed, and reformed several times.  This indicates that forming life is not that extranordinary, if certain criteria are met: right abundance of heavy elements, right temperature range and fluctuation, right radiation sheilding, etc.

Probably only a small percentage of planets meet those conditions, but the universe is a huge place.  Much, much larger than most people imagine.  Our own galaxy contains between 200 and 400 billion stars (cite).  All the stars that we can see and have studied are in our own galaxy.  (For the sci-fi geeks out there, pretty much all sci-fi stories take place within a single galaxy, no matter what kind of propulsion they are using).  And of the stars we can see, we know that planets are somewhat common.  We’ve already found over 200, and we’re just figuring out how to do it (cite).

Even if planets capable of supporting life are very uncommon, say one per 500 billion stars, that still means that there are a lot of candidate planets.  In a typical galaxy there are between ten million and one trillion stars (cite), so even with the small number of candidate planets used above, that would give 0-2 candidates per galaxy.

To get an idea of just how many galaxies there are in the universe, check out the Hubble ultra deep field picture: link.  Do yourself a favor and download the high-res image and start counting the number of galaxies that you can see.  Now consider that that image represents a portion of the sky about one tenth the size of the moon, and that it is typical of what you will see in all parts of the sky.  There are over 100 billion galaxies in the observable universe, and an estimated 70 sextillion (7×10e22) stars in the known universe (cite).

Given these facts, I find it almost ridiculous to believe that we are alone in the universe.  (See the Drake equation for more info).

However, I really doubt that aliens have ever visited our planet.  The distances between planets is amazingly large (the nearest star of 4.3 light years away, and the nearest galaxy is 160,000 light years away), and considering that we have only been broadcasting recognizable signals for about 50-60 years, this give a small range of other planets that could have even detected us, not to mention traveled over to us.

Furthermore, life needs (relatively) heavy elements to form the complex chemical structures to make intelligent beings.  These heavy elements are only made in the supernova of stars (pretty much all matter started out as hydrogen and helium), and it takes a while for enough stars to go supernova, reform more stars, go supernova again, etc. until there are sufficient heavy elements.  This means that other life couldn’t have been around too long before it appeared on our planet.  I just don’t think that there is enough time for life to have arisen anywhere else and traveled over to visit us.

And even if aliens were able to detect us and travel over for a visit, do you think that they would use their immense intelligence and advanced technology just to cut up some cows and draw some circles in our crops?

Webs United States Posted on 09/28/2006 at 04:06 AM

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I’ve been chatting up the guys at the Bible Code site,

Man I don’t know how you have the patience to chat with them.  It’s gotta be like banging your head on a brick wall.

Saying music today sucks was my half ass attempt at being facetious.  I do like some modern day music, but unless a folk artist wrote it, it probably sucks.  However…

If you want to hear amazingly good music written by the most famous independent band go here: Dispatch. Just a little history for those of you that give a shit wink, Dispatch in their final concert had over 120,000 people show, and from 22 countries.  They advertised the entire concert just by word of mouth.  The same way they did all their other shows.  As soon as the link open, you can listen to all their albums using the bar on the top of the page.

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zilch Austria Posted on 09/28/2006 at 04:27 AM

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DWangerin: Yes, with the exception of one point: although I don’t doubt the possibility of life starting repeatedly on Earth, I’ve never heard of any evidence for it.  Such evidence is hard to imagine- how could you tell the difference, from fossils, between a life form on our family tree and one from another family tree?  I suppose if there were incontrovertible evidence of a sterilizing catastrophe occuring after a time from which fossils are known.  But I’ve never heard of any, and given the incredible range of habitats inhabited by life today, it’s hard to imagine anything having sterilized the Earth without having evaporated the oceans, which has never occurred since their formation, as far as I know.  But if you know of any concrete evidence for multiple beginnings of life, I’d be very excited to hear it.

If anyone is still interested in 9/11 conspiracies, Popular Mechanics, my favorite magazine when I was about twelve to fifteen, does the right thing.

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You were born.  And so you’re free.  So happy birthday.
- Laurie Anderson

LuckyJohn19 Australia Posted on 09/28/2006 at 04:29 AM

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Consi: Proof that even in the craziest of humans there are redeeming qualities to be found.

LOL  Thankyou - I think.  wink
Yeah, I question my sanity every time my mate asks: And where’re you going with this, John? or:
Back up the truck a bit ... how’d you get from what we were talking about to what you’re talking about now?
And that’s a mate, isn’t it? Someone who knows you, and loves you anyway. 
I’ve got Les & Mary doing ‘The world is waiting for the Sunrise’ again - far out - if you can download and listen to it and realise there are only 2 singers and 1 guitarist extrodinaire and his 8-track invention ... you can tell, can’t you - I had an early start on the Mullumbimby Madness and Mt Bingar Fuity Red.  LOL

S-Sadie, I like Hunter‘s stuff too. In a weird way he made sense of it all - the first Gonzo… ?
My favourite Hunter S Thompson quote is: I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they’ve always worked for me. [and they still do ... ambiguity noted]
Running a close second:
The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There’s also a negative side.
There’s also a negative side … LOL
What’s it gonna be boy, Yes or No? ... I gotta know right now ... Can it get better than NOW!?
Replay
Replay

And … a close third?  The Edge ... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is, are the ones who have gone over.
Yeah … I know ... I’m on the edge; I’m taking up a bit of room.

I had a little trouble thinking about what I was sure of ... ‘what do you believe in?’.
It reminded me of Monkey and: Cleverness learns something, but wisdom gives up some certainty every day.
I must be fucked.  wink

Brooks: ... love and appreciate The Doors

I had to Google to remind me when Jimmy died - I was in bed, been back ‘in country’ 6 months and my ‘life support system for a cunt’ woke me up to tell me Jim was dead.
I didn’t get excited.
I’d been inured against stuff (?) .  :(
We’re just riders in a storm ... stoned ... immaculate .. smile

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I’ve discovered that it all boils down to brain wiring: your brain is wired to worship magic or it isn’t, either it’s wired to utilize logic or it isn’t, either it’s analytical of myths or it isn’t.

LuckyJohn19 Australia Posted on 09/28/2006 at 04:47 AM

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DWangerin: However, I really doubt that aliens have ever visited our planet.

Why not?
Picture y’self as a young lad ... with all the resources ...
Wouldn’t you go for a cruise?
Oh, right, we’re dealing with ‘grown up’ civilisations.  LOL

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I’ve discovered that it all boils down to brain wiring: your brain is wired to worship magic or it isn’t, either it’s wired to utilize logic or it isn’t, either it’s analytical of myths or it isn’t.

zilch Austria Posted on 09/28/2006 at 05:11 AM

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Brooks- I don’t think anyone here is saying that all the music from the 60’s is better than all today’s music.  While I sometimes pass my daughter’s room rather quickly to get away from the noise, other times I go in, listen a while, and ask her what I’m listening to.  There’s even crappy medieval music…

We’re just riders in a storm ... stoned ... immaculate ..

Speak for yourself, bub.  I’m sitting, it’s sunny outside, haven’t had a whiff for months, and I’m sure as hell not immaculate. tongue rolleye

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You were born.  And so you’re free.  So happy birthday.
- Laurie Anderson

Les United States Posted on 09/28/2006 at 06:45 AM

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Short on time this morning, but I’m definitely stuck in the 80’s and early 90’s music wise. Some stuff from the 70’s isn’t too bad and there’s even a handful of Disco songs I can tolerate. Outside of a few exceptions (e.g. The Beatles) I’m not overly fond of most music from the 50’s or 60’s.

As for my strangest belief, I’d have to say it’s my unending faith in my fellow humans’ ability to improve themselves in spite of their nature and despite all the evidence that seems to contradict such a belief.

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All I know is the wine lasts longer when you don’t gotta share it with someone
All I know is my steak tastes better when I take my steak tastes better pill
-- I Feel Fantastic, Jonathan Coulton

zilch Austria Posted on 09/28/2006 at 08:17 AM

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As for my strangest belief, I’d have to say it’s my unending faith in my fellow humans’ ability to improve themselves in spite of their nature and despite all the evidence that seems to contradict such a belief.

And you all thought that the 9/11 conspiracy nuts and the UFO aficionados were strange!  Les is an optimist! Hahaha! Sigh…

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You were born.  And so you’re free.  So happy birthday.
- Laurie Anderson

LuckyJohn19 Australia Posted on 09/28/2006 at 09:12 AM

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Zilch: While I sometimes pass my daughter’s room rather quickly to get away from the noise, other times I go in, listen a while, and ask her what I’m listening to. 

Please de-mystify the music for me, darlin’ daughter (cos it’s just noise to me). LOL

I’m sure as hell not immaculate.

Ah, that word immaculate - PERFECT.
I know that in any moment of time I am ... immaculate.
Yeah, I know perfection leaves no room for any ‘more perfection’ but as we’ll never (an absolute) be able to define perfection, let alone get there, I am (for me) as close as I’ll ever be, without more knowledge and experience, to perfection. (a lot of provisos in there, A?)
During my straightest of times I can just sit, relax and breath and recall the ‘feeling’ and the speed of thought processes (or is it the de-acceleration of all thought) and just be here, or there.

EORave. smile nearly

I’m listening to ‘Solace – A Mexican Serenade’ - Scott Joplin – wow, that left hand work is sooo beautiful, mesmerising … immaculate … as are most his rags.  wink

We’re just riders in a storm

We are always at the whim of the Goddess called Fortune no matter how much we try or which decision we may make; it’s just a bet against (or is it with?) providence.
KISS
I’m listening to Django & Stéphane doing Tears; with two fingers missing he’s still the master.
Django and Stéphane are as different as Stéphane and Yehudi - it is said that one told Nigel Kennedy it was more important to feel the music; the other told him it was more important to practice.
Stéphane said: Improvisation, it is a mystery. You can write a book about it, but by the end no one still knows what it is. When I improvise and I’m in good form, I’m like somebody half sleeping. I even forget that there are people in front of me. Great improvisers are like priests, they are thinking only of their God.
A-mon. smile

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I’ve discovered that it all boils down to brain wiring: your brain is wired to worship magic or it isn’t, either it’s wired to utilize logic or it isn’t, either it’s analytical of myths or it isn’t.

Consigliere United States Posted on 09/28/2006 at 09:20 AM

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Just some quick commentary on music.  Almost all the great songs have cowbell.  To be timeless, there must be cowbell. http://www.geekspeakweekly.com/cowbell/data_search.pl

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To die one’s self is a thing that must be easy, & light of consequence; but to lose a part of one’s self--well, we know how deep that pang goes, we who have suffered that disaster, received that wound which cannot heal.
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zilch Austria Posted on 09/28/2006 at 10:09 AM

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LJ- what you said.  Django and Stéphane are great.  I spent a fair amount of time in the 70’s playing street music, mostly Joplin rags arranged for our quartet (flute, clarinet, trombone, and French horn).  Ah, those were the days… although we never made much money.  Didn’t even have groupies.  But we had a lot of fun.

You’re not immaculate till you’re dead.  Alternatively, you’re always immaculate, since there’s no logically defensible definition of “perfection” that’s any better than any other, except perhaps “nothingness”.  Or “everythingness”.  Whatever.  Good on you.

Consi- yes, there are some good songs with cowbell.  Who can argue with “Creep”, “Suite: Judy Blue Eyes”, “Purple Haze”, or “Helter Skelter”?  But cowbell does not confer timelessness.  “Rock Lobster”?  “Psychotic Reaction”?  Pulleeze.

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You were born.  And so you’re free.  So happy birthday.
- Laurie Anderson

Patness Canada Posted on 09/28/2006 at 01:07 PM

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Zilch,

In my (limited) experience, willingness to believe strange things extends from the willingness to question and a lack of willingness to question against. Regarding 9/11, there are still lots of unanswered/unanswerable questions and that means plenty of legroom for laziness.

I think my strangest belief has to be the idea that people are all on the parallel - that we all have the same potential. I mean, it’s probably useful for me, but I have no idea if it’s right or not. I often act from the other side of the fence. See, when I think of strange beliefs, I think of beliefs that are awkward or make little sense. I’m sure you’ll all find them during my time here, (laughter). Everyone else thinks I’m odd, I’m sure you all will, too.

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One sure and primary and fundamental fact is the joint existence of a subject and of its world. The one does not exist without the other. I acquire no understanding of myself except as I take account of objects, of the surroundings. I do not think unless I think of things — and there I find myself. - Bruce Lee

Sadie Jane United States Posted on 09/28/2006 at 01:58 PM

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Most of my favorite music is from the ‘60s and ‘70s. I love some ‘80s as well, though, and I even enjoy some ‘90s.

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zilch Austria Posted on 09/28/2006 at 02:07 PM

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Regarding 9/11, there are still lots of unanswered/unanswerable questions and that means plenty of legroom for laziness.

Indeed, Patness.  Of course, lots of unanswered/unanswerable questions are exactly what one should expect in an event of this magnitude.  What exactly happened on 9/11, or, say, exactly how life evolved, can never be known with the certainty that the truth the Bible can be known.

I already find you a bit odd, but I think all intelligent people are a bit odd.

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You were born.  And so you’re free.  So happy birthday.
- Laurie Anderson

KPatrickGlover United States Posted on 09/28/2006 at 05:51 PM

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LJ & Sadie,

As you’re both fond of the good Doctor Thompson, I have to ask if you’re familiar with Warren Ellis, paticularly his “Transmetropolitan” series about a near-future sf version of Hunter. It’s absolutly brilliant and brutal satire that I think you’d both love.

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EyesOnly Great Britain (UK) Posted on 09/28/2006 at 07:54 PM

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Giants and Aliens walked the Earth a long time ago. Then they left.

Then they came back, to Roswell.

The weather balloon thing is a cover up.

An agreement was reached with the Aliens that they would give us technology in return for humans not infesting the rest of the galaxy.

They are coming back, probably sometime in the next 20 to 30 years, at which point they will give us more technology and also reveal some of the secrets of the universe!

Some of the early Alien visitors played practical jokes on humans, that is how some of the worlds religions got started, by accident!

Those responsible were punished for breaking the prime directive.

Other planets.

Sadie Jane United States Posted on 09/28/2006 at 08:22 PM

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KPG: I’ve heard the name Warren Ellis, but I’m not familiar with his work. I just might have to check it out, though. Thanks for the reference!

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LuckyJohn19 Australia Posted on 09/28/2006 at 10:11 PM

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Patness: Everyone else thinks I’m odd, I’m sure you all will, too.

I’ve never found you weird in any way - but coming from me that means little, yes.  LOL

KPG: I have to ask if you’re familiar with Warren Ellis

I hadn’t heard about him.
Sounds like an interesting character, thanks for the pointer. smile

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I’ve discovered that it all boils down to brain wiring: your brain is wired to worship magic or it isn’t, either it’s wired to utilize logic or it isn’t, either it’s analytical of myths or it isn’t.

LuckyJohn19 Australia Posted on 09/28/2006 at 10:21 PM

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EO: Some of the early Alien visitors played practical jokes on humans, that is how some of the worlds religions got started, by accident!

That theory is much more credible than Genesis and goddidit.  wink

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I’ve discovered that it all boils down to brain wiring: your brain is wired to worship magic or it isn’t, either it’s wired to utilize logic or it isn’t, either it’s analytical of myths or it isn’t.

Godless Raven Canada Posted on 09/29/2006 at 12:32 AM

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Hmmm...if by “strange” I’m talking about foreign to popular belief, I’d say that my belief that George Bush sr. played a part in arranging the assassination of John F. Kennedy while a member of the CIA is right up there. It’s probably one of the only things I can really think of. My evidence is purely circumstantial, but I believe I can mount enough of it to make a minor case. At the very least, he was present in Dallas, was a member of the CIA, he approached J Edgar Hoover to question him about the anti-Castro reaction to the assassination...the CIA has already been implicated by some in the assassination. I also believe that Lee Harvey Oswald was a very willing participant in the assassination. I just think he got screwed over when the going got tough. Great...now I sound like a nutjob. Thanks guys, I knew there was a good reason this question made me feel uncomfortable. smile

memo: http://www.tomflocco.com/Docs/Jfk/PresJfkBush.gif

Click the icon in the bottom right corner to increase the size of the memo that Hoover wrote. He mentions Bush sr. and look at the title of the memo. Funny, when asked when he was running for president, Bush lied and said he wasn’t a member of the CIA during this time period.

http://home.earthlink.net/~twainable/id18.html

There is other evidence that he was present in Dallas during the assassination, and...well...I believe based on the political careers of both he and his son, it’s pretty clear how they feel about human life.

He also benefited from it politically.

(Regarding 911, without any conspiracy theories, anyone here have an explanation for how Rice was able to warn her friend Mayor of Sanfransisco Willie Brown not to fly the day of Sept 11th 2001 on September 10th 2001? Because she did, and it’s a fact. Brown was a fool for revealing that information the morning of 911, he clearly didn’t realize what it was implicating. There has yet to be an explanation why or how she would call him to tell him not to fly on 911 without implicating previous knowledge. So no conspiracys. Just a legitimate question that has never been answered honestly. The phone company verified that the call was made, and Brown told reporters she called him to warn him not to fly. The rest is arguably debatable.)

Godless Raven Canada Posted on 09/29/2006 at 12:49 AM

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Erhhmmm...everyone here would agree (I presume) that the fire fighters were incredibly brave and selfless on 911. How many of you have seen this video? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C26k0nCE1_M&mode=related&search=

Do you think he was lying? The tower came down within a minute of that video. Explanation?

Godless Raven Canada Posted on 09/29/2006 at 02:29 AM

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Actually, feel free to throw those claims in to this “strangest things you believe” catagory.

Here’s the most obvious thing I believe. Something that is somewhat “strange”, but completely obvious and completely factual. It has to do with 911.

First of all, professionally and scholastically, I have 2 areas of expertise. Finances, and sciences.

I believe that there are a lot of loopy mistruths being spread about 911 by mostly well meaning people, but when you get truth+emense emotions+imagination the results are pure FUBAR confusion. I have personal experiences with the makers of Loose Change and their regular posters. We do not get along. They and their regulars are all well intending, however they’ve allowed paranoia and fear to cloud their critical thinking skills. There were also a few anti-semites amoungst their regulars that I often fought with. I’m also not a big fan of Alex Jones and many of the largest proponents of 911 consipracys. What I am however, is interested in the science behind 911, because I know for a fact the official story is false. It’s not even a decent hack job to account for what happened. So what did happen? I would love to get the collective of this website to take a challenge I am offering and help all of us figure it out to the best of our abilities. What have we got to lose? If we are not conspiracy nut cases, then there is no harm in examining the science, correct?

Now, I believe based on my limited experience on this website that the average IQ of the regulars on here is higher than the average IQ of the populous. (I’m right, aren’t I? *laugh*) So this is a great opportunity, to challenge all of you.

Here is my challenge.

Watch the following video in its entirety:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6708190071483512003

The videos title is “9/11 Mysteries” and can also be found in other locations, but google video was the most convinient for me.

You have to promise to watch the entire video. It is about an hour or so long. The first 40 or so minutes are nearly exclusive science. Physics, chemistry and a little bit of biology. (Mostly physics and chemistry). This is nothing like Loose Change or any of the other conspiracy type videos you will ever see. This is about as close as you are ever going to witness of a scientific break down of the events of 911.

Please...do not take my word for anything. Do not take their words for anything. In fact, feel free to take the opposite opinion of everything you are about to hear and see on the video if you like. However, when it’s all said and done, I would like to meet with all of you on another thread, set up exclusively to discuss nothing but the science behind 911.

Now here is the thing...my challenge is not just to watch the video. My challenge is for all of you, or any of you to watch the video and then do your absolute best to disprove ANY of the scientific claims on the video. I consider myself ignorant on many things in this world. I do however consider myself quite knowledgable on many of the sciences that come up in the video, and I’ve spent the past 2 weeks to try disprove the claims. I can find a few websites that were blatant shills for the admin, and have been proven as such, but I really don’t want someone to just post a link to a website that refutes things. I want the group of you very intelligent ladies and gents to prove as many of the scientific claims of this video as you possibly can. Then I’d like to get together and discuss them in a mature, respectful manner. I’m willing to take in new information and ideas from all of you should you prove anything or disprove anything in the video.

I’m still pretty new on this website, but I think it’s safe to say that we all care about the fate of the world. The implications of just the science of this video are...grander than anything else I can think of right now.

Please...allow me this one challenge and accept. Please do the research on each of the claims and bring to the follow up discussions anything you wish. I promise I will be more than polite and am willing to hear everyone’s opinions.

Will you take it? Will you accept the challenge? Is the fate of the world worth it to you? You are just as free to watch it and say “Ahhh...I still don’t believe” if you like. But...then I’d like to have an open discussion of what we all think and why.

All I can do is humbly hope you accept and if all goes well, several of you will post ideas and theories based on the film and perhaps with our collective intelligence and experiences we can postulate a true accurate theory that reflects the just of all of our beliefs.

Again...please do me this favor and participate. Even if you don’t, please watch this video.

Thank you very much, and I have to say it’s been an complete pleasure to meet all of you kind folks.

p.s. - Admin/Les - Sorry, I’m still a big rookie at this. Should this challenge have been put in it’s own formumn? If so, how do I do that? If you can help or give me advice, I’d really appreciate it!

Thanks

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