Don’t forget Ohio!!

Oy.

Jesus is how the South lost the civil war?  Here all this time I thought it was brilliant military tactics by the Union, coupled with a solid leadership, and a healthy dose of “Mo’ money.” [among other things… never once did I see religion come into play]

But the rest of the post is beautiful.  Make sure Southerners aren’t making base assumptions, while professing one of your own.

What is it the guinness guys say?  Oh, ya… BRILLIANT!

He wasn’t talking about religion, he was talking about the lack of education down there.

Post = funny.

How about the “Battle Hymn of the Republic?”

Oh, wait! That was the north side . . . 

I still think Lincoln should have let the dumbfucks secede! They’d probably be part of Mexico by now.

Yeah, but Mexico would kick them out after getting tired of them misdispronunciatin‘ all the spanish words wrong, and with that horrible drawl… Then they would become a 4th world country isloated until some ambassodor tries to de-isolate the country but gets kicked out on account of he mentioned evolution in a casual conversation once, causing all the townfolk to gather in the Townsquare, taking a break from their usual cross-burning and inter-family relations to drive the city slicker out of town back to meximico or North USA or wherever the hell he came from, only to kill each other after someone says ‘maybe he’s right...’

...you get the picture

True, true, true, and true, but the bible was meant to be taken as a fact, whether it’s true or not, or whether you believe it or not.

I always thought evolution was more of a “Cockamamie theory” than Intelligent Design.

Those religious folk you speak of would have more of a right to complain of secularism being shoved down their throats than the other way around.

Actually, the Bible as literal document is a relatively new viewpoint. There was a time when pretty much every Christian considered it to be more allegory in nature than literal truth. Even today strict literalism is a minority viewpoint held by certain Christian sects.

If you think Evolution is more cockamamie than Intelligent Design then I’d hazard to guess that you’ve probably not bothered to read up much about either topic.

TheBo$$:
Yep, it soitinly SOUNDS like me!

Actually, the Bible as literal document is a relatively new viewpoint.

There’s a fascinating discussion about the evolution of the literal interpretation of the Bible in “The Battle for God” by Karen Armstrong, a tour de force history of fundamentalism in Judaism, Christianity, and Islam.  She points out that fundamentalism of all flavors arises as a kind of digging-in-of-heels as standards of education rise, and to serve political purposes.

...but the bible was meant to be taken as a fact, whether it’s true or not, or whether you believe it or not.

TexasMarine, there I agree with you.  But it was written at a time when people thought the earth was flat, and for most of them, was a worldview that offered them more dignity than what went before.

Nowadays, we know better, and can put our Bibles down, reverently to be sure, and move on.

As a lifelong resident of the deep south, I can safely state that secularism has NEVER been shoved down my throat.  Was I forced to pray twice a day in my sixth grade public school classroom long after this was declared unconstitutional?  Yup.  Have I been approached at gas stations, various store parking lots, concerts and businesses by freaks handing out religious tracts and asking if I’ve been saved?  Yup.  Do they actually show up at the door to my residence on a regular basis?  Yup.  Have I been verbally accosted by coworkers regarding issues such as my chances of rotting in hell and prayer in public schools?  Yup.  Has my OWN SISTER visciously attacked me for responding to the religious garbage she cloggs my inbox with?  Uh huh.

No Secular Humanist has ever approached me in the parking lot of Target.  No athiests come to my door and ask me to renounce all faith.  And yet, somehow even surrounded by this crap, I maintain my disbelief in fairies, the easter bunny and God.

Loris- have you accepted Darwin as your personal saviour? I did, and it changed my life.  No more pangs of guilt when I rob banks and rudely shove aside old ladies at the checkout.
True, I don’t have Pie in the Sky when I Die.  But I can sleep as late as I want Sundays.

“Loris- have you accepted Darwin as your personal saviour? “

Um no.  I actually have no need for a personal saviour.  Which is kind of the point.  I don’t rob banks or shove aside old ladies either, as hard as that may be for a “Christian” to believe.

Loris- I don’t mean to put words in Zilch’s mouth, but I’m pretty sure he was being facetious there.

As long-time (former) resident of the south, I TOTALLY agree with you- the idea that anyone down there is getting secularism shoved down their throat is a joke. Most of the people making that complaint are freakishly unaware of just how throat-shovy they are. One of my first memories of Texas is pulling off of the highway towards our new neighborhood only to see a giant billboard with The Jesus glaring down at us under the words “Jesus is alive, and coming soon!” Once we got over our initial distate, we found it amusing to read aloud from the billboard whenever we saw it, providing the logical conclusion ourselves: “Jesus is alive, and coming soon...to a theater near you!” This was a little funnier before the whole “Passion” debacle.

Of course, now that I understand the mentality of the local moralizers better than I did as a 13-year-old kid, I realize that a lot of them probably considered the billboard as a counterbalance to the “secular” ones advertising cigarrettes and booze. It’s easy to think the secular is being shoved down your throat when you get to define anything not overtly religious as an insidious attempt to secularize, and I’ve witnessed people do just that on countless occasions.

PS You’d think there would been an equally evocative yet less suggestive phrase than “shoved down the throat” to describe the same phenomenon, but damned if I can think of one.

You’d think there would been an equally evocative yet less suggestive phrase than “shoved down the throat� to describe the same phenomenon, but damned if I can think of one.

Ulfrekr, how about: .....

uh, never mind. I guess the one I have in mind is more suggestive and just as evocative, in an equal and opposite way…

but the bible was meant to be taken as a fact, whether it’s true or not, or whether you believe it or not.

Was it really meant to be taken as fact? Both the old and new testament abound in allegory, parable and metaphor—all used illustrate some point about human nature or the relationship between god and humans. Seems odd that the actors of the old and new testament used abundant symbolic language and yet the books of the bible are thought (by some) to be written as literal fact.

Eisegesis abounds within the literalist tradition—just try ot get a coherent interpretation of predestination (or anything else) out of a group of fundies.

But then, I digress. . .

If you guys ever find yourself on I-65 somewhere around the Alabama-Tennessee line, be sure to look out for the gigantic sign with a cutout devil sillouette and verbiage that reads “GO TO CHURCH...OR THE DEVIL WILL GET YOU!” It’s on some farmer’s land. He’s got a couple of other silly displays up too, but that one is by far the best. Oh, and “SEE ROCK CITY” while you’re around.

I can’t believe they didn’t spell it “git chu”.

On of the days I’m going to remember to take a picture so I can post it.

Ulfrekr…

I didn’t realize how curt I came across with that last comment until I re-read it. 

Sorry!

Shelly wrote-

Eisegesis abounds within the literalist tradition—just try ot get a coherent interpretation of predestination (or anything else) out of a group of fundies.

Isn’t it ironic that fundies now commit eisegesis, when originally it was the Roman soldiers who wanted to “ice a Jesus”?

Was it really meant to be taken as fact? Both the old and new testament abound in allegory, parable and metaphor

True enough, Shelly. There are many levels of storytelling in the Bible, and I suspect that it’s meaningless to try to specify exactly how it was meant to be taken.

One must remember that the Bible is a hodgepodge by many different authors, much of it passed down in oral tradition, and thus molded by many minds with many different worldviews and different axes to grind, long before being written down in the canonical versions we have today.

Unless we believe that it was all inspired by God, we must ask “whose meaning?”

If you ask me, though, I would guess that straightforward narratives such as Genesis were meant to be taken as fact, and that the parables were meant to be taken as, well, parables.  But we’ll never know for sure, unless God tells us.  I’m still waiting for Him to weigh in on this, but so far all I get are people who claim to know Him.  And since most of them also voted for Bush and say that the Earth is 6000 years old, I’ve sort of lost interest…

Oh please, complaining secularism is getting shoved down your throat is like complaining that air is getting shoved down your throat. Look at the definition of secular. Technically any non-religious conversation or any non-religious thing someone says to you can be considered secularism. A conversation about computers, or cars, or whatever non-religious thing can be considered secularism. But what do I know...?

When I was a Catholic, I never took the Bible as fact or knew any catholic that did. Even in Catholic High School Scripture classes they make no big deal out of saying that the Bible is not 100% fact, and that the RCC has accepted evolution.

I thought it kinda odd that I was approached by missionaries in the parking lot of a WalMart in Meridian, Miss.  Looking to sell jesus where most people already have one.  Might as well sell sand to someone living on the beach.

Not a JC sign, but on Hwy 105 in SE Texas, somebody has a homemade “Get U.S. out of the UN” sign up.

Having lived in Mississippi, Louisiana, and currently Texas, Mississippi was the biggest Jesus sell, and south La was the least.  Sometimes I wonder if it has anything to do with the mix of Catholics and Protestants.  I do wonder about how much pressure my daughter’ll get from the jesus crowd here in DFW, since there seems to be more of the youth oriented jesus sell.

If you guys ever find yourself on I-65 somewhere around the Alabama-Tennessee line, be sure to look out for the gigantic sign with a cutout devil sillouette and verbiage that reads “GO TO CHURCH...OR THE DEVIL WILL GET YOU!�

Actually, that’s JUST north of the Montgomery/Prattville area.  It’s hilarious, too.  I fully expect the Great Satan holding the scythe to actually move in a back-and-forth motion; alas, it is not to be.

He’s got a John 3:16 billboard up, too, and a water wheel with some religious slogan.

[Recently transplanted from Alabama to California, and that’s one of the few things I think I’ll remember.]

Actually, that’s JUST north of the Montgomery/Prattville area.  It’s hilarious, too.  I fully expect the Great Satan holding the scythe to actually move in a back-and-forth motion; alas, it is not to be.

OMG, you’re right! I have my Nashville trips on 65 confused with my Auburn trips on 65. Whoops, sorry for the misinformation. (I’m not a stupid hick, I swear, I’ve just got a bad sense of direction)

He’s got a John 3:16 billboard up, too, and a water wheel with some religious slogan.

Yes! It’s kinda small and set off the road, I’ve never been able to make much out of it at 75mph, but the devil sign can’t be missed.

I’m glad someone can corroborate this sighting, it’s almost stupid enough to sound made-up.