A call for calm after the election storm.

Posted by Les on Thursday, November 04, 2004 at 03:28 PM. Read 4388 times. Tags:
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I’d like to ask everyone who’s upset over Bush winning re-election to pause for a moment, take a deep breath, and just try to relax. For the past 24 hours or so far too many Liberals have been running around as though hot nuclear death were raining down from the sky and they only had minutes remaining to be someplace else very far away. More than a few people have emphatically stated their intentions to move to another country and I’m sure more than a few of you are deadly serious about it. Quite a few others are wasting energy on being angry, depressed, worried, bitter, melancholy, or what have you and often times more than one of those emotions at once. In short, a lot of us are being not just reactionary, but over-reactionary to this development. Yes, I think a lot of us are overreacting and not thinking this through with a clear head like we should be.

For starters, nothing has really changed yet. America didn’t suddenly become a theocracy when Kerry called Bush and conceded. None of Bush’s goals in his agenda suddenly became a foregone conclusion with his reelection. The Bill of Rights wasn’t set alight and outlawed the moment Bush gave his victory speech. But you might think all of those things had happened if you were to judge us simply by how we’ve reacted. The truth is America still has a long way to go before our worst fears become reality and the worst thing we could do that would help ensure those fears come to pass is to throw our hands up in frustration or flee like scared rabbits.

Let’s address the option some folks are considering of moving out of the country. Canada seems to be a popular choice for a lot of folks who are seriously considering leaving mainly due to its more left-leaning government and populace. Canada is certainly willing to take you on, but you’ll have to get in line with everyone else who’s trying to move there from other countries. Word has it that legal immigration to Canada can take upwards of a year and then it’s another three years before you can become a full citizen. You could move in ahead of schedule if you manage to land a job there first and that’ll require a work permit, which is still a good four to six months in the future if you apply today. As long as you’re waiting you may as well ask yourself a few questions starting with, ‘Do I really think this means I’m leaving the problems in America behind?’ Consider that for a moment: For better or worse, America is the most powerful nation on the planet. If we were all to give up and abandon ship leaving the country to the right-wingers to do with as they please, how long do you think it would be before you once again started to feel the impact of that decision? If the Dominionists succeed in their goal of reshaping America into a true “Christian Nation” as they envision it, do you really think they’re going to be happy with that and leave the rest of the world alone? We’ve already read about how their goal is, quite literally, world domination. Imagine an America reshaped and run by these people. Do you honestly think you’d be safe anywhere on the planet with them in control back here?

For those of you who are busy panicking over this development you should be asking yourself, ‘How does this help the situation?’ The short answer is: It doesn’t. At best it’s a waste of energy and at worst it confirms everything the opposition believes is true about us. It also tends to feed on itself as it’s difficult to think clearly when you’re busy overreacting and we end up falling back on some of the very tendencies we take Conservatives to task for such as black and white thinking. Caught up in our own emotions we resort to knee-jerk reactions and lose sight of some very important facts.

For example, take a look at this USA Today map that breaks down how each county in each state voted into either Red of Blue. If you’re a Liberal then you probably find the sight of that map a bit depressing, but does it really say anything other than a particular county was won by one side or the other? No, it’s a simple binary depiction that gives you no indication how close the race in any particular county might have been and if you do some searching you’ll probably find that the race in many areas was very close.

Consider Oakland County, Michigan where Kerry got 319,607 votes and Bush got 316,567 making for a 50% to 49% win for Kerry with a mere 3040 votes difference. Now contrast that with Alpena County, Michigan where Bush scored 7,665 votes to Kerry’s 7,406 making for another 50% to 49% win for the other side with only 259 votes separating them. More importantly take a look at Michigan as a whole in that CNN county-by-county breakdown that colors the counties based on how strongly they allied with one side or the other. By my count there were at least 16 counties that were so close as to not show a hint of either red or blue and there were only a handful of counties that could be considered to be strongly on one side or the other. Looking at the other states you’ll find a couple that were mostly blue-tinted such as Massachusetts and a couple that were mostly red-tinted such as Oklahoma, but in a lot of them you’ll find that there’s an awful lot of white counties where it could easily have gone either way and even more counties where support one way or the other was just barely enough to give the state any tint at all.  If we were to apply this graduated concept to a map of how the states voted you might end up with a map like this one over at BoingBoing.net which has an awful lot of purple on it.

That’s the effect of those moderates we keep forgetting about that make up a good portion of the population. People like ***Dave who tend to lean liberal, but still has some consevative aspects to his nature as well. I think ***Dave is a good representative of the moderate viewpoint in part because of his entries dealing with his struggle to decide which candidate he was going to vote for. I take comfort in the fact that when I look at those maps that provide a graduated scale showing how strong one county or another happened to be for either side that the majority of them could be open to persuasion and a well reasoned argument to go the other way next time.

It’s important in times like this that we are level-headed enough to look for what the reality is as opposed to what we fear it might be. Just as the majority of Christians aren’t far-right Fundamentalist assholes, not everyone who voted for Bush is a die-hard Conservative who is beyond all reasoning with. It’s easy to forget this because we generally tend to get into arguments with the folks who ARE those things as opposed to the moderates. It’s also important to remember that we argue with them not because we foolishly think we’ll change their minds, but because we’re hoping our reasoning will resonate with the folks who are open to considering other viewpoints. If we just throw up our hands in frustration and feel sorry for ourselves, though, then we will end up with a self-fulfilling prophecy. We can sit around and pout and point fingers at what age groups we had pinned our hopes on that didn’t show up or how 51% of the nation must be clueless morons or any of a dozen other excuses we can dream up. Or we can take a deep breath, take a critically honest look at ourselves, our message, and our situation and then move forward determined not to let this setback crush our spirits. The only constant is change and even the darkest days eventually give way to better times.

Comments:

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VernR United States Posted on 11/06/2004 at 06:00 PM

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neodromos. If your list names the 1,100 or so dead officially reported by the Pentagon, it doesn’t under-reports the actual number of deaths due to combat. The Pentagon doesn’t report the number of soldiers who die in hospital. (I’m not exactly sure where they draw the line.) I have heard that the number is closer to 3,000.

Spocko United States Posted on 11/06/2004 at 07:02 PM

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Adam, it’s called humor - deal with it.

Keith Richard Radford Jr. United States Posted on 11/06/2004 at 07:11 PM

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I am an old guy and friend were going to Nam and not coming back. I watched as the Gov. beat and killed in the name of protecting a way of life, those artists and fredom fighters of the sixties. The musicians that came by untimely deaths. I have walked across the street from a school under siage to see as far as the eye could see, uniformed officers in full riot gear and kids I saw each day shot down because they believed it was time to stop the machine. In the early seventys I pumped gas and had a man come in to the station where I was a gas jockey and inform me he had just got out of a long tearm planning meeting as a Union Oil Executive and lay down all the plans of the oil companys including the wars and pricing because he was angree about our future. I have know, and spoken,and fought for years. Those that layed down their lives for our country are doing it because they believed in an America. They believed in an economy that feeds or familys. That economy is oil. We have new Technologies that negate the need for the oil base economy. That is where I feel the need for change. We could be on the road to a new world but NO!. Just like in 1976’ the auto industries looked the other way and gave our nations manufacturing away. How about our banks? We do not have a word bank. Bush sees a sinking ship and he is going clean out the tresure box before its breached if he can. The fight is not over till I am dead. The orginazation is the key. The building and structure. He know he has only four more years and by the end of that time he will have shown his face. His power is great but that croupts and he is sloppy. This we have seen. It just must be better revealed.

Spocko United States Posted on 11/06/2004 at 07:52 PM

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How ‘bout a map of the Civil War? Look familiar?

We should have let the fuckers go!
Maybe ‘ol Abe wasn’t such a great president after all, eh?

Keith Richard Radford Jr. United States Posted on 11/06/2004 at 08:26 PM

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Now that’s funny!

Spocko United States Posted on 11/06/2004 at 08:50 PM

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Sorry Les, I guess I’m being “anti-topic” - I’ll stop that. sick

crazyrepublican United States Posted on 11/06/2004 at 10:21 PM

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krrj - the drama is killing me!!

i am sensing the ‘those stoopid idiots ruined my life’ syndrome picking up steam here.  i think i’ll bow out now and let you agree with each other on how idiotic half the country is.

hasta

nowiser United States Posted on 11/06/2004 at 10:37 PM

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Maybe ‘ol Abe wasn’t such a great president after all, eh?

I think I started making the argument that the North actually lost the Civil War at about the time that Bush was elected to his first term.

I’ve pictured that map in my head before, Spocko; it’s funny-- in a ‘hurts so bad ya gotta laugh’ kind’a way.

 Signature 

It vexes me when they would constrain science by the authority of the Scriptures, and yet do not consider themselves bound to answer reason and experiment—Galileo

nowiser United States Posted on 11/06/2004 at 10:41 PM

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i think i’ll bow out now and let you agree with each other on how idiotic half the country is

I don’t know.  I think if you hang out a bit longer someone will eventually take the time to make a rational response to the questions you posed.

In the meantime, don’t be surprised by the jokes-- humor’s a pretty effective way of dealing with pain. (The alternative is scary, and often involves climbing bell-towers with high-powered firearms).  gulp

 Signature 

It vexes me when they would constrain science by the authority of the Scriptures, and yet do not consider themselves bound to answer reason and experiment—Galileo

leguru United States Posted on 11/06/2004 at 11:30 PM

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What if we gave a war and nobody came? The alpha male, hunter-gatherer syndrome seems to be alive and kicking, at least in many of the younger generation. Perhaps it’s the herd instinct for survival - kill off the weak ones or the herd will perish. My son is a sergeant in the Marine Corps and his dream is to become an L.A. City cop in south-central Los Angeles. For the foreseeable future some of our youngsters want to be in a “kill-or-be-killed” situation. Lets hope that, until we really want to live peacefully, those wars will be limited ones that affect the smallest part of the world’s population and give these kids an outlet. As the protest to the Vietnam War has shown, if the people really want to, they can make the leaders listen and change policy. Maybe we can begin to develop a peace-oriented culture? Hey, stranger things have happened!  big surprise
BTW, Spocko, great maps.

 Signature 

“What is a good man but a bad man’s teacher?
What is a bad man but a good man’s job?
If you don’t understand this, you will get lost,
however intelligent you are.
It is the great secret.” LAO-TZU

leguru United States Posted on 11/06/2004 at 11:53 PM

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Crazyrepublican,
“After my initial victory jig (in another post, cannot remember what thread id it was), the enormity of the situtation really hit - there are 50M+ people in this country that are pissed off/disillusioned/devastated over the results - what kind of country is that?  While you guys don’t agree with my political/economic/social views, I am curious as to what realistic things can be done to unify this country.”
What DOF said and a little dialogue about humanism. Any time you make something (God, Allah, money, oil) more sacred than a human being, you diminish the value of humans and humanity. Lets start looking at those conditions that will allow each of us to become the best we can be without trampling on the rights of others and lets start fighting (politically) to make our government support those conditions. All we are saying is GIVE PEACE A CHANCE. grin

 Signature 

“What is a good man but a bad man’s teacher?
What is a bad man but a good man’s job?
If you don’t understand this, you will get lost,
however intelligent you are.
It is the great secret.” LAO-TZU

joshman3d United States Posted on 11/07/2004 at 12:49 AM

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Brock, I actually burst out laughing in front of my computer when I read that you remembered the"ketchup incident”.  As of late, I’ve been going to art school, where it seems the aforementioned incident could easily be considered a valid installation project.  To be specific, I’ve been in Boston, attending college at the School of the Museum of Fine Arts.  So not only was I here when the Sox won the World Series, but I was also here when Kerry had his big pep rally down at Copley center.  Needless to say, I probably had all the more reason to be shocked that he lost.  I kinda wish Kerry’s concession were delivered at night, so at least there’d be a riot or something.

But on another note: is anybody else getting the impression that Keith Radford is Al Sharpton under a different alias?  He seems to have the same tendency to go off emotionally on subject matter that he can’t articulate in any comprehensive, objective manner.  Kinda like a stream of conciousness, just without the sporadic brilliance.  But I guess I’m being a tad mean, no?

And I really hate it when that kind of rambling discussion discourages the debate of a pompous little crapper like crazyrepublican.  Because damn it, people that staunch should KNOW they’re wrong (though the day may never be).

Heh heh, Jesusland…

Spocko United States Posted on 11/07/2004 at 01:50 AM

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1. Divider not a Uniter.

Just a few things that repulse me…
a) Taking presidency when losing the popular vote. (first time around anyway)
b) Selling out to corporations.
c) Trying to appoint the same judge a year after he was rejected by the Democrats.
d) Sickening use of religion for political gain.
e) Silly “holier than thou” smirk on that face of his.
f) Say “atheists should not be considered citizens” (ok - that was his daddy)

2. What realistic things can be done to unify this country.

a) Don’t do any of the above!
b) Bush should learn to admit mistakes.
c) Reach out to those that DON’T “share our goals”.
d) Put Roe v Wade to bed. Repubs should quit trying to impose their beliefs on others. Noone is forced to have an abortion and Democrats are NOT pro-abortion they support the rights of the individual to make thier own moral decisions and not have “morality”, a very subjective term, embedded in our law.
e) Don’t act like you won by a landslide!
f) Fix the goddamn voting methods used in this country.
g) Limit a lawyer’s take of the pie but don’t limit a patient’s right to sue those quacks that cause real harm.
g) Repeal tax cuts for folks making shitloads of money!
h) Pay off our debts! We can’t keep using the “credit card”! I thought you conservatives were supposed to be good with money stuff. I heard we’re paying something like 3 or 4 million bucks an hour in interest alone!
i) Fire all lobbyists. Permanently.

3. Michael Moore, Al Sharpton, Dennis K, fools, etc…

a) Moore is not a Democrat and I ignore the “false” parts of his movie and concentrate on that which was true.
b) I actually like Al Sharpton, tho I’m partial to those with a sense of humor. He was great on SNL!
c) Dennis K is one funny little mother fucker!
d) Considering the fact that I’m not a Democrat I would have done things differently, but in this silly, two-party, black & white, system who would have noticed?

As to the original topic of this thread, I’ve “enhanced my calm” by tuning out! I’ve been way too absorbed in this shit the last few years - hours of “news” stations, radio, papers, the net, you name it. I’ve restricted my “news” watching to about 5 minutes total since “Black Tuesday/Wednesday”. I have noticed that my blood pressure has fallen back to normal and I sleep better at night. I’m also going to tune out those ridiculous religious channels that have been invading my tube. Sometimes I watch ‘em just for kicks and end up totally disgusted and steamin’ mad at the sheer lunacy of this whole religion deal. It never ceases to amaze me how gullible a bunch of monkeys we still are and at the same time I’m not surprised at all.

With all this free time I guess I’ll catch up with my reading, I’ve been reading “The Circus of Dr. Lao”. This book was made into a movie called “The Seven Faces of Dr. Lao” starring Tony Randall in seven different roles. I loved that movie when I was a kid and it’s interesting to read the original work. There’s quite a bit they left out of the movie that’s kinda nasty or would have been too difficult to create on film I guess, tho the fx were pretty cool for its time.

I’ll tune back in to the political circus in a couple of years (maybe). I know, I’m just sticking my head in the sand but the air kinda stinks.

This is a lttle prayer dedicated to the separation of church and state…

Our Father who art in heaven, and to the republic for which it stands, thy kingdom come, one nation indivisible as in heaven, give us this day as we forgive those who so proudly we hail. Crown thy good into temptation but deliver us from the twilight’s last gleaming. Amen and Awomen.

- George Carlin

oops I guess I’m rambling…

decrepitoldfool United States Posted on 11/07/2004 at 09:18 AM

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i am sensing the ‘those stoopid idiots ruined my life’ syndrome picking up steam here.  i think i’ll bow out now and let you agree with each other on how idiotic half the country is.

Crazyrepublican, several people did make an honest attempt to respond to your original question about why the country was so divided.  Not everyone, true, but discussions are like a multi-body orbit problem; the orbit changes if one body is absent (in this case, you.)

Were you really interested in discussing the problem of division or were you just trying to make yourself look reasonable before an exit?  I thought your questions were good and worth discussing.

Keith Richard Radford Jr. United States Posted on 11/07/2004 at 09:59 AM

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My high school days back in 69’ the country was divided. The though was war. the concern was morality vs. right and wrong.

In my humble opinion it has taken our government this long to disguised and sell the morality issue in regards to oil war as morally correct stance in America.

The issues are not about right and wrong any more but are they moral. The tacking of policy has shifted to the point of unbalanced lawmaking and foreign relations. By use of a value system that works for the half of the nation that see things in moral light there is a black and white, evil and good with no measure of right and wrong. Right and wrong leaves room for measure or degree of measure with no fence as it were to fall off of form one side to the next. Seeing things in right and wrong allows for the mercy of the law to unfold and measure.

This is a fundamental in the separation.

Adam M. United States Posted on 11/07/2004 at 10:25 AM

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Keith,

The increase in the “fundie vote” was not as great as many on the Left (myself included) would like to believe. Certainly not enough to account for Bush’s victory. David Brooks takes a look at the statistics in a NYT op-ed piece.

While there is certainly a lot of division in this country over hyped-up moral issues, there is also a big group of swing voters that are motivated by more diverse and subtle factors. The Democrats clearly need to do a better job of reaching out to these people if they want to succeed.

ellie United States Posted on 11/08/2004 at 08:17 PM

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Along w/ crazy republican, given the moral outrage I’ve read against what y’all consider unjust reasons for war & “giving in” to corporations (by allowing them to buy & sell at only quadruple the tax rate of the rest of us) that are guilty of corruption until proven innocent-

I wonder, where is the moral outrage demanding an investigation into charges that Kofi Annan, France, Russia & Germany for taking oil from Saddam in exchange for votes in the U.N. so he could corruptly continue to pocket the money, spilling the blood of thousands, maybe millions of Iraqis who dared have the wrong ethnicity?

I know that I’m biased in that I’m more likely to believe the innocence of an American Corporation over Saddam Hussein or European corporations & governments failing miserably to cloak their Anti-Semitism, while your biases may be for what some have referred to our “traditional allies,” but do any of you see ANY similarity between the corruption of Enron & the French, German & Russian corporations?  Or even see it as MILDLY suspicious that Kofi Annan has refused an investigation unless the Iraqi people (who are the alleged victims) pay for it?

JoshMan3D United States Posted on 11/08/2004 at 09:48 PM

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Well, it seems that the Republicans were all along trying to appeal to the most gullible, surefire voting base - conspiracy theorists!  If you want to get fucking dirty with business deals, look into Halliburton and the Bush family themselves, and tell me that ANY of these people are moral.

Are we supposed to fight villains with villains now?  Seems reeaaaally wrong to me.

How ironic!  My word thingy is “consider”.  HA!

Trotsky United States Posted on 11/08/2004 at 10:07 PM

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Ah yes, another wonderful posting of half truths and distortions by Ellie. What would we ever do without her?

Keith Richard Radford Jr. United States Posted on 11/09/2004 at 02:57 AM

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Here chew on these for a while

http://www.newsfrombabylon.com/article.php?sid=2621
http://www.newsfrombabylon.com/article.php?sid=3402
http://www.rense.com/general44/deaad.htm
http://www.rense.com/general32/charged.htm
http://www.rense.com/general32/bhh.htm
http://www.fortbendstar.com/Archives/2003_4q/122403/n_Woman who filed lawsuit found dead.htm
http://www.apfn.net/messageboard/03-21-04/discussion.cgi.73.html
http://www.unknownnews.net/cache18.html
http://www.drizzten.com/blargchives/000130.html
http://fp.enter.net/~haney/jt112203-2.htm
http://www.global-elite.org/print.php?sid=205
http://treasononline.blogspot.com/2003_11_09_treasononline_archive.html
http://www.retortmagazine.com/content/06.04/id_article_ponziny.htm
http://ez-websites.com/grudge/
http://www.apfn.net/messageboard/03-21-04/discussion.cgi.72.html
http://www.bartcop.com/
http://www.independent-media.tv/gtheme.cfm?ftheme_id=24&fdate_posted=%7Bts ’2003-11-14 00:00:00’%7D
http://www.independent-media.tv/item.cfm?fmedia_id=3058&fcategory_desc=Under Reported
http://www.disinfotainmenttoday.com/issue32.htm
http://www.oilempire.us/bush.html
http://www.disinfotainmenttoday.com/issue79.htm
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2002/12/48880.html
http://www.drmenlo.com/archive/2003_11_09_archive.html
http://www.rense.com/general47/bushsmitten.htm
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread64757/pg1
http://www.blackopradio.com/bush_murder.html
http://www.newsfollowup.com/bush_rape.htm
http://www.thoughtcrimenews.com/bushrape.htm
http://sf.indymedia.org/news/2002/12/1550404_comment.php
http://www.disinfotainmenttoday.com/issue92.htm
http://www.libertythink.com/archives/2002_12_08_archives.html
http://www.thc-ministry.net/forum/archive/bush-rape-accuser-found-dead-562.htm
http://english.pravda.ru/main/2002/12/13/40786.html
http://s90114153.onlinehome.us/html/modules/mydownloads/
http://www.mindprod.com/bush911.html

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2002/12/48880.html
In the end, this investigation yielded the following information: Plaintiff had seven dates, (which became seven lovers), had told no lies, committed no crimes, gotten 2 traffic tickets and dated George W. Bush as a minor.”

ellie United States Posted on 11/12/2004 at 03:04 PM

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It’s hard to find these threads again!  Anyway, maybe I should have made it clearer, Enron is clearly guilty, & their conduct was despicable, but I was writing that I don’t think that makes EVERY corporation guilty.  Conspiracy theory?  You didn’t answer my question (do you see any parallel?) unless your think it’s all a lie(conspiracy theory).  In that case, who do you think is making up the lies, & why?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A52682-2004Oct21?language=printer

Keith Richard Radford Jr. United States Posted on 11/12/2004 at 07:14 PM

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I do not think it is lies. Conspiracy theory? No! It is not a action but a view of action. Like Enron for example, case in point, the economy must continue to survive, then what is seen by the welthy as the trickle down effect, because they spend so much fuels the poor. Scraps you know.

ellie United States Posted on 11/14/2004 at 04:01 AM

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I don’t understand your answer!  I majored in rhetoric, wrote my senior thesis on it.  Rhetoric is the many different views of actions, but there are ALWAYS actions, NEVER “not a[n] action.” (Just like there is always matter with many different views of it, but there is NO anti-matter.)

Do you see any similarity between the corruption of French, German, & Russian corporations accepting bribes from Saddam from money that was meant to aid the starving & Enron officials doing insider trading against employee’s retirement funds?  If not, what is the differnce?

Larkinsjapn Japan Posted on 11/14/2004 at 09:36 AM

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It is good to be calm, not to react in a hasty manner, Fangorn (Treebeard) the Ent always said. Besides its not like its over, votes are still being tallied, the mighty whurlitzer? may be playing MannnnnnDateeeee, but nothing is official yet. In fact at least one state is in do over mode already. I apologise for my home state Ohio, I guess we were really jealous of Florida, and wanted to show them how its done. For sake of disclosure I am a wild eyed radical conspiracy monger with delusions of grandure. And I am still worried about that misplaced RDX and HMX and what kind of Christmas surprises will be in peoples mailboxes this year??
It sucks that I am in a different time zone and when I am reading and replying I am really, really tired. Its midnight here and I have been trying to keep up with three really great hyperactive ofspring, but I do wnat to put my two-cents in. I survived a really bad war (I thought never again) then the protests to stop it. I only have one regret that I didn’t follow the lead of many of my brothers and get into politics. I abandoned my duty, because I thought that my country had abandoned me! Now with the passing of years and the acceptance of adult resposibilities through raising a family, I have come to terms with myself and understanding more about the time in which I grew up. Hindsight is wonderful except it happens after the fact so a bit non-sequitur to this argument.
But I am in for the long haul, and I think the best days of the Republic are before us. Hell the Republicans have held power almost my entire adult life, and it hasn’t destroyed the country, or the progressives, and we can still worship or not, and tomorrow still comes.
Good night or Good morning.

Keith Richard Radford Jr. United States Posted on 11/14/2004 at 10:20 AM

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Too few words to express a thought, Enron, morally can be justified in the minds of those that bend the law.
They are the same people who lobby and pay to have items written into law. After the process of law, the use of its complexities and loopholes are exploited by the same corrupt group that pushed its creation.This is an Action on the part of the corrupt designer or backer of the designer of a law. When a person has a vested interest, it is generally steeped in the litigation, and someone will win and lose. More often than not the strong survive and the week are the ones that suffer. More often than not the strong are strong in law due to the corrupt nature of those concerned with it. One the world scene, energy is a wonderful commodity. Like the phone company and phone calls the wires are in and the maintenance is expected. So all you do is set up a company and use it within the law marginally, create a fright or two, and charge what you will for the commodity. Snake oil, Gas Masks, or Oil. The money is so big that the world is involved not just Enron or Halliburton, its countries. All countries need to fuel there economy. When they are being locked out by one, (not allowed to bid) they will find a way to internationally compete. Saddam is beyond any doubt a bad guy in our eyes. He has a way that we do not approve. It is a cultural thing that his people have lived with and some do agree and approve. Some countries see things like they would chose to see them like a small child that would rather not eat and go to bed hungry than to do what was told them to do.
Hit the ball = Action singular

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