[Editor’s Note: It was my intent to have a reply ready before posting this, but I’ve found myself putting it off due to a busy weekend so I’m going to go ahead and post it as is. I’ll address it properly in the comments as soon as I have the opportunity though I’m sure there are several regulars who will probably be more than capable of addressing it first.]
I’ve heard repeated here several times that Horus, an Egyptian god, is carbon copy of Jesus. The obvious implication by those that have made this statement is that Jesus is a copycat version of an earlier Egyptian deity. The purpose of this entry is to disembowel that proposition once and for all.
When I first heard that Horus was the inspiration for Jesus several years ago, I didn’t give it much credence because I couldn’t establish any source material for the claims. I still can’t, but the internet is as adept at allowing anybody and everybody to pass on misinformation.
Upon further research, I’ve concluded that this theory originated with Gerald Massey, an English poet, born 1828, died 1927. He published primarily poems, but had an interest in Egypt. He parlayed that interest in Egypt into several books and lectures in which he set forth the proposition that Horus was in essence the first Jesus, and Jesus was a cheap imitation. The primary basis for his writing is the Egyptian Book of the Dead. This is available on-line and you can easily look it up to read it yourself. Be forewarned that forced reading of this would be an extremely efficient form of torture.
It should be noted that Massey’s actual proposition was that Jesus was a copycat from more than just Horus. According to Massey, Jesus was a compilation of an innumerable number of Egyptian deities. There were over 2,000 deities who had every human and godlike characteristic one can think of, excepting Superman’s power to stop a speeding bullet.
Since Massey, there is a dearth of anybody with any credentials that has adopted a straight Horus=Jesus theory. There is a one individual that has adopted some of Massey’s thoughts and incorporated them into a book-The Christ Conspiracy. This appears to be the basis for the claims that I see. The author is Acharya S. Her website is http://www.truthbeknown.com I note that Richard Price, a noted Christ Myther, and one that I take much more seriously then Acharya, said the following:
“Those of use who uphold any version of the controversial Christ Myth theory find ourselves immediately the object not just of criticism, but even of ridicule. And it causes us chagrin to be lumped together with certain writers with whom we share the Christ Myth butt little else…..
His other criticism, like mine, is that she uses very dated sources (19th Century) who were in Price’s words “eccentrics, freethinkers, and theosophists.”
Les, I am using your post from 1/3/05 as an example of the claims because you carry more credibility than most. That said here are the claims and what I have found:
Claim #1-Horus and Jesus are born from a virgin.
Horus’s mother is Isis. Isis was married to Osiris. We do not know for what length of time, but presumably the marriage was consummated. Whether it was or wasn’t doesn’t matter though. After Osiris is killed, Isis puts him back together again (he was hacked into 14 pieces) except for his penis which was tossed in a river or a lake. Iris fashions a substitute penis for him, humps him and here comes Horus. There is nothing virginal about that.
Claim #2-Both Horus and Jesus were born to a Mary and Joseph. (Seb)
As noted Isis is Horus’s mother’s name not Mary. In addition, Seb is not Horus’s father, Osiris is. Seb is Osiris’s father. Further, Seb is a distinct name from Joseph. Putting them side by side does not make them synonyms, and that appears to be what was done here.
Claim #3-Both were born of royal descent.
This is accurate.
Claim #4-Both births were announced by angels and witnessed by shepherds.
I can find nothing that mentions that the birth of Horus was announced by an angel or witnessed by shepherds. I have found that Horus was born in a swamp, which is a pretty unlikely place for shepherds. In addition Acharya mentions that Horus was born in a cave. Massey makes no mention of this, although he does represent that Mithra was born in a cave.
Claim #5-Both were heralded by stars and angels.
There is no star that heralded Horus’s birth nor is there any angel announcing it. Archarya in a footnote in The Origins of Christianity indicates that that there are three stars named the three kings in Orion and then relates this to the birth of Jesus. When we look to the stories regarding Horus, we find no star or angel announcing his birth. To the extent that Acharya S relies upon Massey and Massey relies upon what is depicted in the panels at Luxor see (from an atheist) further regarding virgin birth and pronouncement by angels http://www.frontline-apologetics.com/carrier_luxor_inscription.htm
Claim #6-Both had later visitors (Horus-3 deities and Jesus-3 wisemen.)
There is no indication that there ever were 3 wisemen. The bible never mentions the number of wisemen, nor is there any document that reflects 3 deities at the birth of Horus. See the website referenced in Claim #5.
Claim #7-Both had murder plots against them.
There is mention that Seth did want to kill Horus, and Herod wanted to kill Jesus. so this is accurate.
Claim#8-Both came of age at 12, were baptized and their baptizers were executed.
There is no indication that Horus was preaching in a temple when he was 12. In fact, Massey indicates that Hours the child was depicted as a “weakling.” That doesn’t jive with story of Jesus preaching in the temple. Again this appears to have been a confabulation from Acharya and repeated by others.
Horus was never baptized in any of the Horus stories. In addition, Acharya mentions that John the Baptist is actually Anup the Baptizer. This individual is never mentioned anywhere in any Horus account. There is not even a footnote in Archaya’s on-line work The Origins of Christianity to support this. There is nothing.
Claim #9-Both had 12 disciples.
According to the Horus accounts, Horus had four semi-gods that were followers. There is some indication of 16 human followers and an unknown number of blacksmiths that went into battle with him. Horus did not have 12 disciples. Jesus reportedly did. Acharya failed to give a footnote to support this.
Massey points to a mural in the Book of Hades in which there are twelve reapers. Horus is not present in this scene. For Massey to make this connection he goes to a different scene within the same mural. In this scene there is a picture of a god whose name is the Master of Joy. Horus is never depicted although in other murals the artists do depict Horus. Had the artists ascribed 12 reapers in any relation to Horus all they had to do was put Horus at the scene. They did not.
Claim #10-Both walked on water.
Horus didn’t, or at least there is no record that I can find that he did. Massey does not maintain that Hours did. Massey uses wild conjecture to connect the story of fish man, Oannes, not Horus, to Jesus. Oannes came out of the sea during the day, and went back into the sea at night. Massey makes the two analogous because by his calculations, Jesus walked on water during the day.
As to Acharya, she as usual provides nothing to substantiate this.
Claim #11-Both performed miracles.
This is true although the miracles were different in scope and nature.
Claim #12 Both exorcised demons and raised Lazarus.
The actual claim is that Horus raised Osiris from the dead and that the name Osiris morphed to Lazarus. It doesn’t matter because Horus did not bring Osiris back to life. There is no mention of this in any document regarding the story. Horus did avenge Osiris’s death, but that did not raise Osiris from the dead.
Claim #13-Both held a Sermon on the Mount; both were transfigured on a mountain, died by crucifixion along with two thieves and were buried in tombs where they paid a quick visit to Hell and then rose from the dead after 3 days time, both resurrections were witness by women, and both will supposedly reign for 1,000 years in the Millennium.
These are the most damning claims if they were proven true in my opinion. Yet, I can locate none of this. No sermon, no transfiguration, certainly no crucifixion w/ two thieves, no trip to hell and no resurrection. There was an incident in which Horus was torn to pieces and Iris requested the crocodile god to fish him out of the water he was tossed into, which was done, but that’s it. I am at a loss to refute this because I can not find anything to support it.
Massey does compares a story about the Autumn Equinox related to Osiris, not Horus, as the symbolic crucifixion. There is no indication that Horus is involved in any way. There is no mention by Massey of any Sermon on the Mount. No mention or any actual crucifixion, no two thieves, no burial in a tomb. Massey does not maintain that anything of the sort occurred with Horus.
In short, of the claims outlined in this entry, I find the comparison between Horus and Jesus to consist of the following: they were of royal descent, they allegedly worked miracles and there were murder plots against them.
867 Responses to “Ending the Myth of Horus”
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*Sigh* I agree with Newatheist. I just spent a while reading all the comments to this article at once. Now that my head is done spinning I must say a few words.
First of all, when I had browsed around the internet and read Nunya’s posts I saw a lot of word for word copy and pasting going on. However, I never once saw him post a link of some ancient acknowledged source on the subject. He just continued posting assumptions and conjecture that he copy and pasted from other websites which were in turn copied from the books of a few atheists which were written through more assumptions after reading Papyrus Anu//Book of the Dead which were preconcieved by their professors lectures on ancient religion in college.
Things are never as they seem, and yet events can always be portrayed to be similar to others.
For a vast majority of the dissenting posts on this website I have watched a bashing of the validity of the Bible. This isn’t even in the scope of the argument. I believe fervently in the message of the Bible. Hell, I know very well that there was fluff inserted in several places by random entities including the abominable catholic papacy.
Again. this is beyond the scope of the argument. Here is what I have gathered from the Book of the Dead … the Bible … and 35 pages of comments.
Isis lifted Osirus’s dead body and proceeded to extract his seed in order to concieve a child. To even remotely assume a virgin birth after reading that line of the Book of the Dead is an unusual conclusion. Even if the book of the dead directly said it was a virgin birth it would still not make sense. Every part of that Plate in the BoD suggests that it was a physical conception that Isis took part in.
Also, I noticed that when consig would refute a particular similarity by using the book of the dead. Nunya would proceed to attack Christianity (which is not part of this argument) or repeat what consig had just shown to be an unsupported conclusion.
Consig shows the Seb was not Horus’s earthly father. In fact, I cant believe anyone suggested so in the first place. Seb is Osirus//Isis Father. Seb was married to Isis? no… Joseph was the father of the christian God? no… Joseph and Mary were brother and sister? no… Joseph was a God? no… how could you possibly equate Joseph and Seb? They are completely different in all ways. They arent even both human.
Asar proceeds to become Lazarus. However, if you continue to do the math Nunyabiz becomes Nun if you just subtract the yabiz … so I guess Nunyabiz must be a Nun by profession. To get from Asar to Lazarus you need to add a prefix… add a suffix… subtract a letter and change the s to a z… just four changes to the name to set the story to be how you want. Meanwhile I only subtracted a part of that guy’s name and turned him into a catholic Nun … DAMN IM GOOD
In the end. It doesnt really matter. Faith holds this world together. It brings the hope of tomorrow. Some people use their religion as an excuse to justify some terrible things that they do. They take the scripture and manipulate it to make what they are doing seem OK. In the same way you take the story of Horus and use it as another way to justify your refusal to take something on faith. Crusades, inquisition, native american trail of tears, conflict in middle east, muslim terrorism… all are simply stretches of scripture to justify their hatred or fear or greed… attributes that most religions dont even teach. The thing is… even if religion didnt exist they would just find a new reason to justify their actions. As long as people have the free will to do what they want, there will always be corruption in the world… which brings me to my final message
If you dont believe faith keeps the world from falling apart, allow me to reveal who I truly am. I am not alone. There are several of me out there. This is what I am:
I am a christian. Only one this rules my life, and that is Reason. God is Reason. the notion of God is perhaps the greatest logical certainty I have ever known. This is because the idea of God determines … no … DEFINES… right from wrong… good from evil… If you do not believe in God… how do you determine right from wrong?
You don’t. If I deny the existence of God, there is nothing to stay my hand. Any feeling I will act upon and the result of which would be terrible. I spent the first 20 years of my life listening to the words “Life isnt fair, deal with it” … God IS what deals with it. If God did not exist, then I… we… would be forced to decide what is good, and what is evil.
Deciding right from wrong on a personal basis is a dangerous thing. If I failed to acknowledge God’s existence:
I would choose to feel emotion… that’s right, I would decide to vent what I have suppressed for 20 years of my life. All those times of viewing the ultimate unfairness of the worldy circumstances of others… would manifest my emotion. I would choose to act to smite corruption. There would be nothing to stay my hand. I hate corruption. I truly believe that all humans are just that, corrupted. You may choose to think I am some messed up, disturbed individual…catch 22… your opinion doesnt matter to me.
I spent my whole life watching as time and time again humans screwed eachother over. Murder… theft … betrayal … lies … deceit … jealousy … malice … hypocrisy… the list goes on and on. However the fact remains that all of us have committed some of them without shame. I hate that. Hatred. Anger. It’s all suppressed by God’s directives. To prove God doesnt exist is to want to destroy yourself. Pure Hatred. Ultimate Anger.
Imagine building a dam in your mind… to hold back all of your terrible feelings… regarding the actions of your fellow man… all because you know that releasing them will harm that which you have come to love. God IS this dam. You live your life by divine providence… like it or not.
Although I love you all so much… the hatred that your actions inspire take away my vision. I implore you not to try and prove to a Christian that God does not exist… because a christian with wavering faith is a weapon … and a tool of destruction.
Take away my God… I will destroy every last one of you. God inspires and requires forgiveness. Which I am gladly willing to grant in honor of his Name. Take it away … and nothing will stop me from annihilating all. Without an ultimate construct of justice… I would choose to make my own justice… this goes against the basic human desire to live.
please… I would get on my knees if I met you in real life… DO NOT TAKE AWAY MY PURPOSE… I love you all because God inspires to forgive… take it away … and I will lose myself to hatred and rage. Please… if you do…
Me and those like me… would lay waste to civilization.
That’s a good argument why we should kill theists quickly, before any great number of them wise up and realize you’ve all been duped without a basic command of the being responsible for your own morality.
PS Man, you’re a loser.
morality? who determines morality? I take full responsibility for all of my actions. Yet, it is as you say. Because I don’t have the ability to fix the world I see broken… I am loser by default. I don’t really care. I would prefer you to kill me… it would only further enforce my view of a corrupt and immoral species called humans. In the end… it doesn’t really matter.
I am only telling you how things would be if you took away the construct that determines morality. In reality… I would die to protect any human. even the lowlifes… I would die for you… the one who would condemn me for not taking responsibility for morality. I would die for Former president Bush… the one who invaded a country without good reason… killing several hundred thousand innocent civilians.
I would even die to protect Osama Bin Laden… because all life is sacred to me … because despite all that bin laden has done… there is possibility for change … for remorse… for repenting… and I will die to protect that life and the potential for change.
The truth is this … all humans have done terrible things… and if all things were fair … we would all have to pay for our misdeeds.
But so long as I hold my faith… I will protect that which I love … life.
I dont wanna make it seem like I am some random idiot. I know most of you will just see me as some random loon that doesnt know what the hell he is talking about.
However, the problem is that humans need something absolute to hold onto. Without god… Hobbes rules the world… and you will go to sleep each night… with Leviathan at your side… while you lay there wondering how you will survive the chaos of another day.
For the peace and brotherhood of men…
Delkerramak
Too late. You’ve got too much in common with Bin Laden, you miserable idiotic fuck.
Just goes to show that some people are competent enough to cope with reality and need that invisible sky daddy to cling to.
Interesting… unfortunately this has nothing to do with coping.
Why shouldn’t I kill you right now?
Why shouldnt I rob you of the little money you own?
Why shouldnt I lie and tell you that the USA is a country that promotes good in the world?
Why shouldnt I screw your mommmy while youre at work till she cant walk straight?
God answers why.
Nothing you atheists have can justify the laws we have in the world.
Imagine a world based on people killing as they pleased … doing as they pleased.
Currently atheists just say stupid stuff like we kill just because we wouldnt want it done to ourselves… bullshit.
That’s not a reason. If something makes you feel better, you do it. This is the only shit I see atheists do… live a life of pleasing the senses. It’s l’etranger in a nutshell.
Continue trying to take away the answer to WHY? … I dare you. Just make sure you kill me before you arrive at some insane conclusion which was gotten through a long line of text manipulations with almost no primary, secondary, or tertiary sources provided from the person who rooted the damn thesis in the first place.
Call me a child… unable to cope with the world… doesn’t really matter to me… I spent my entire life sitting back to watch the human race fuck itself… and I believe the show is about to reach climax in a few years.
Off to make some popcorn.
(as for the person who called me like osama bin laden)
Do you think that osama bin laden would die to save the president of the united states? save yourself the brainpower … i assure you he wouldnt
All life is of value to me… regardless of the person… this belief I secure from my God.
This is how I see it.
Osama Bin Laden is responsible for the death of thousands of innocent people.
The president of the United States ordered an invasion that killed several hundred thousand innocent people.
I hold that both parties have done great evil. Yet, I would still die for either of them… hoping that one day just one of them might realize the evil they do.
Neither party believes they are doing evil… they believe they are doing the right thing.
It’s rule number one about people in this world…
#1 People are stupid, They will believe anything to justify their actions.
In the end. It doesnt really matter. I value life simply because my God commands it. I really havent seen any atheist propaganda to make me value life on a different basis.
People like Albert Camus and his butt buddy Satre at the very least try … yet ultimately fall short.
They just sit there and tell everyone that you make your own life. Well… yeah … duh, I can convince myself that a cat can literally die 8 times and ressurect itself… but that doesnt make it true. It doesnt hold with logic since I have definitely seen a cat die once and stay dead.
God is the most logical thing in the world. Just looking at the complexities of entities… things get infinitely smaller… humans>animals>plants>insects>protists>a single cell>organelles>atoms>subatomic particles>quarks
is it so irrational to think there is something infinitely complex in that direction… or the other direction… humans>ecosystems>planets>solar system>galaxies>universe
beyond the galaxies scientists claim to see nothing… is it not possible that there is something infinitely complex in that direction … rather… isnt it probable?
There are complexities of this world which humans simply cant wrap their mind around. Everytime they think they have their mind wrapped around it… some new aspect of it baffles them.
It truly is a logical and rational thing to believe in God. It requires little faith. It is roughly equivalent to a scientist making a good assumption. Many scientists have done just that. Just take a look at all the major thinkers in the history of the world …
But again… in the end. it doesnt really matter. You will most likely never step out of your The Bible is Bullshit box. You know that if you accept the existence of God as truth, youre in trouble. You should know that if you take away the laws of this world you are also still in trouble. And if you dont know… dont play with fire by trying to do so through this website.
Much of morality is arbitary. Some places you can marry at 14. In others this would make you a pervert. Crimes occur where there is a disinhibitor to break the way we were raised, or that initial block was ever placed in the beginning. The cheif inhibitor to commiting a crime, after social conditioning, is fear of getting caught- not the punishment. Ergo if you tell children from a young age there is someone watching them all the time, when they grow up believing in a Invisible Sky Daddy then they believe they will get caught. A similar process can be seen in very young children when they are good for Father Christmas. It is a demonstratable fact that threatening a child with Father Christmas finding out has a noticable effect in November and December- as any parent can attest. The existence of Father Christmas is not made more real by their behaviour or their belief in him.
The fact that societies without a belief in the Abrahamic God also manage to be moral, either through belief in their own gods, or humanist reasoning in child upbringing, shows that your god is not a prerequisite.
So then why does
Logic and rational thought never requires faith. Only that that you can not understand requires faith.
ooh that one. Who? Excluding those who were brought up in a society where the social pressure was to force Christianity on individuals. (Did you know some landowners in pre 20th century Britain would evict tenants who didn’t go to church. Puts a real pressure on people to yell “I BELIEVE” if the choice is a homeless family)
Les- This one is all yours- no cussing now, just the facts.
Really? Nothing? What sort of rock have you been living under that you’ve never heard of secular humanism? Honestly, are you that stupid?
Yes, it is.
And by that logic you don’t value life at all, because if your invisible friend told you to kill us all you’d apparently start shooting. You’re a boneheaded Nazi, not a saint. “I do this because I was told to” is how you send Jews to gas chambers.
Just to keep on with this vein of thought, you realize that valuing something only because someone else told you to is a particularly pathetic sort of sociopathy, right? It’s like saying “I can’t connect with people on the basis of anything but threat of reaction.” It’s serial killer logic, and you’re trying to berate us for our lack of ethics?
I repeat: You’re exactly the same sort of nutjob as Bin Laden. You’re one late night away from going off the deep end and murdering people because Jesus spoke to you from the mouth of a black dog. You’re one papal pronouncement away from bashing in the heads of all Muslim children within your reach. You’re a sick fuck.
nah man… I told you… there is only one thing you can do to get me to kill a human being… and that is to prove to me that there is no reason not to… i.e. prove that God does not exist.
Since you can not do so, you have drawn an incorrect conclusion in assuming I am one bad night away from going off the deep end.
I most likely wouldnt even kill to save my own life… though I do not condemn others who which to preserve their own lives.
Yes, God is how I connect to other people. Although I am not sure what threat you are thinking of since there is really no threat I can remember in the Bible.
As for your Nazi comparisons… that also does not apply. The reason being I dont listen to voices in my ear. Killing innocent people doesnt match with what I was taught and learned through the gospels.
The people who killed thousands in the crusades all claimed they did it for God… despite the fact that such merciless slaughter is directly against the bible… despite the fact that the bible says nothing about securing the “Holy Land” as a requirement to attain paradise.
Listening to the voice in your ear is directly against the Bible when the voice tells you something that goes against all reason.
Secular humanism? I am a secular humanist… being one does not mean you are atheist. It just means you have weighed dogma and havent taken it JUST based on faith… which I havent. Not only do I have faith, I also reach my belief in God based on logic. I am an engineer … I use the scientific method frequently to solve problems. I use it to measure my beliefs as well.
Scientists make assumptions all the time because they believe that the evidence suggests a good chance of it being truth. That is simply all I do. It seems likely… after examining a great deal of evidence… that God exists… case closed.
A secular humanist is tolerant of others because he has in mind the well being of others. That’s me in a nutshell. Just my reasons for valuing the well being of people are different from yours.
In fact, I implored you all to stop spending so much of your time trying to shoot down religion and faith in order to preserve life. Never try to take away someone’s purpose in life… because then YES they will go off the deepend and much that you value will perish.
Call me a nut if you wish. In the end, it doesnt really matter at all.
Anyways, please move on to a new assumption of my character so that I might denounce it.
So basically you’re resorting to threats to uphold your faith.
“I would kill all of you if you disprove the existence of my god. So back the fuck off.”
Nice. You’re really ethical, loser.
I have never made a threat. All I said is that it’s a bad idea to back a lion up in a corner. Would you not get maimed if you did that? If you went to Swaziland in Africa and spent a lot of time physically interacting with AIDs carriers, would you not most likely get infected?
If you had your country invade the middle east, would you expect no resistance? For every choice, there is a consequence.
And that is all I have said. I am not threatening to kill you if you try to prove my beliefs wrong. I am telling you the consequences of that action.
You want to take away something central to the lifestyle of hundreds of millions of people… this is dangerous. Try cornering a lion to see what I mean… then amplify the effect a thousand fold… you still wont understand the chaos of what would happen if you disproved God’s existence.
Regardless, it is not the case that horus=jesus because I have yet to see one ancient primary secondary or tertiary source noting it. All I see is a bunch of authors manipulating ancient text to make it seem to be so… so until I see otherwise. I declare Consigliere the winner.
Not a threat?
Threat: An act of coercion wherein a negative consequence is proposed to elicit response.
Want to try again Mr. Internet Tough Guy Piss-Me-Off-About-My-Religion-I-Will-Kill-You?
Precisely. I am not trying to coerce you. I am just telling you that your actions have terrible consequences.
I ask you not to try and prove God doesnt exist yet I recognize your right to choose for yourself.
Right now you are trying to corner a lion. My telling you that the current course of your actions will result in something you don’t want was not meant to coerce you. I apologize if you interpret otherwise.
If your skin is highly sensitive to sunlight and yet you insist on being outside right as the sun is rising… then how am I threatening anyone by simply telling you that you will feel alot of pain in the next 10 minutes. All I did was state a fact…
Stick your hand in fire and you will get burned. I am not trying to coerce you into not putting your hand in fire… the choice is still yours.
I do, however, request that you think twice before continuing down this path if you do indeed value life. actions have consequences that we individually cant control. it is simply how the world is.
This is a really silly argument. You’re never going to find an exact correlation because these are both mythologies, religions (call them what you want) that have been translated and tampered with hundreds of times. Refusing to acknowledge the similarities with one God (Horus) does not change the fact that their are dozens of other dieties with very similiar attributes as Jesus Christ. Why is this so hard to beleive. We know for a fact that many of our Christian holidays are just adopted Pagan Holidays, and most also know that nobody knows the exact day Jesus was born. We also know that Christianity was first absorbed by the Roman’s who were for the most part Polytheistic and no strangers to stretching the truth.
I don’t see how there is any possible way that Christianity could have survived without absorbing aspects of other monotheistic (Judaism) and Polytheistic religions. It also helped that most of western Europe was forced to convert to Christianity to save their heads by our friends the Romans. I’d say Roman Catholic reputation is enough to defuse most of Christianities relevance without picking through any sort of historical fact(s) that the Bible offers. I mean it’s been translated by perhaps the most notorious and longest running criminal organizations in western civilization and yet we still search for evidence that Noah set his Ark here and Moses smashed the 10 commandments there. Instead of so called “non beleivers” having to disprove religion, let’s see someone actually find me some historical evidence that any of these miracles, or marvelous happenings ever occured. The only real evidence seems to be in the previous myths that already recorded these happenings. The Flood Myth for example existed long before the Bible was forced upon the world but does that make the story of Noah true? Or does it simply assure the notion that there may have been a flood at some point that screwed over a bunch of people and this one guy perhaps named something like NOAH but probably not got in a boat with his dog, his wife, and his kids and waited for the rain to stop.
One Last question, where did all the other boats go during the flood?
Delkerramak is obviously a dumbass and this thread has gotten long enough. Time to shut it down.
You’ll need to shut it down again.
True, it got opened again in the move.