The Drudge Report is offering up a few quotes out of Ann Coulter’s upcoming book titled TREASON: Liberal Treachery from the Cold War to the War on Terrorism that would suggest that AC views former Senator Joe McCarthy as a sort of martyred hero:
“The myth of ‘McCarthyism’ is the greatest Orwellian fraud of our times,” Coulter pounds. “Liberals are fanatical liars, then as now. Everything you think you know about McCarthy is a hegemonic lie.”
“Liberals denounced McCarthy because they were afraid of getting caught, so they fought back like animals…
“McCarthy was not tilting at windmills. Soviet spies in the government were not a figment of right-wing imaginations. He was tilting at an authentic Communist conspiracy that had been laughed off by the Democratic Party. ”
CHAP 4: THE INDISPENSABLE JOE MCCARTHY
If any other religious cult knew so few basic facts about its own seminal beliefs as the liberal cult does about Joe McCarthy, Janet Reno would gas them.
Despite the leftΒs creation of a myth to defeat legitimate charges of treason, McCarthy had so badly stigmatized Communism, his victory survived him. In his brief fiery ride across the landscape, Joe McCarthy bought America another thirty years. For this, he sacrificed his life, his reputation, his name. The left cut down a brave man, but not before the American people heard the truth.
Man, and I thought Bill O’Reilly was a major douche bag. I can’t begin to describe my amazement that she would try to proclaim Joe McCarthy some sort of hero worth emulating or that his actions were in any way justified. The fact that this book will probably be a bestseller leaves me with the chills to think so many people consider her ravings worth reading.
Update: Solonor has written up an excellent rant about this that you should all go read right now. He manages to say everything I should have and provide a wealth of useful links on the topic of McCarthyism.
Jo-
Considering that there are far more poor in this country than you folks who have worked hard to achieve 60k+ per year, I have a better proposal. We should let everyone who makes under 60K annually have an entire week off from all work. Not paid, not 3 months, but a single week. Everything, and I mean EVERYTHING, would come to a screeching halt on the first day. You wouldn’t be able to go to Wal-mart (or wherever) and purchase anything. Your electric, phone, etc. would be down in a day.
My point is that while you “rich” all seem to think that investments are the most important thing to our economy, and that taxes kill these investments, it is the human factor that really keeps things going.
Besides, with such huge tax cuts from Washington in the wings, won’t it be we poor people who do end up paying most of the cost of things such as the war in Iraq? I’m not an economist by any means, but deficit spending ends up being payed for in the end by somebody, even if it is future generations (of poor working people.)
I also wonder how it is that you can criticise poor working people at all. Have you ever experienced poverty (I know you mentioned being black in a previous post, but I am NOT assuming anything about you from that information.)
It is not easy to escape poverty by any means. Working harder is not always an option when you can only find low paying jobs to begin with. While some wealthy or better off people indeed have risen to their status through sheer will and determination, I know personally that it is not always possible, and in fact is very unlikely for most. The old addage of it not being what you know but who you know surely has some role to play in this.
In general our society is stacked against the poor, almost designed to keep them where they are. It is for this reason that I don’t believe that socialized health care would be a bad thing (though I believe that welfare needs serious reform beyond what it has already recieved. BTW, I am currently working a part time job and going to college to get my degree, all prompted by me being laid off from an “okay” paying job. I have never been on welfare, medicaid or any other government program except for financial aid to help pay for my tuition.)
Anyway, As to whether or not someone who makes $60K a year is rich, you can look at the poverty line, and see the difference between the two. While the government publishes a standard for the poverty level, wealth is subjective. If you have ever made less than $15k a year (in the past 10 years or so), you might understand why someone who does make so little might see someone like you as wealthy. You are entitled to your money, no doubt, but the rich are not superior to the poor. Likewise, if the “rich” tend to use more resources through investments in industry, enjoying luxuries, or whatever, why should they not be expected to pick up more of the tab? Perhaps I am naive here, but I really do not see a good retort to that question.
A final thought. If you think that the rich are somehow superior to the poor, you might want to consider history, and the various peasant revolutions that have occured throughout the ages. The only thing that seperates rich from the poor is the amount of paper strips that were issued from the federal government each of them possess (or can possess by liquidating assets, etc.) That is it. We are all human, and perpetuating a lie that basically boils down to the Divine right of Kings is not the wisest thing to do, and I believe it to be quite disgusting. If that is class warfare, so be it.
Now go ahead and tear me a new one Jo, I look forward to you disecting my arguements and telling me how I am so wrong and all. However I would like to see an intelligent debate far more.
Jo, if you couldn’t stand to read Ann Coulter’s book, how can you say “But on most accounts she is right”(?) In my opinion the only purpose Ann serves is to foment distrust and discourage accountability and cooperation. New information made available concerning Senator McCarthy’s credibility and intent can help in a way that only expanded information does; that’s all well and good. But Coulter has precious little business relating that information. Her impartiality and integrity is suspect by many from the get go.
,,,why should they not be expected to pick up more of the tab? Perhaps I am naive here, but I really do not see a good retort to that question.
Retort: Why should I have to work 70 hours a week to have 45% of my money go to someone else? It’s my fucking money thats why. I worked hard to get where I’m at. And just because I make good money doesn’t mean I don’t work. That’s another problem with you people. It’s only the ‘poor’ who work hard. My ass. Beep Beep Beep – Fries are done. 8 hours, your home.
And I’m not criticizing ‘poor working people’. My family was poor growing up. Very poor. So don’t preach to me about the poor as if they’re some glorified group of people. There are good, bad and worse poor people. A lot are just plain lazy. A lot want to live on the ‘draw’ as they call it. A lot don’t want to work at all. A lot don’t want to work hard. It’s all thier choice.
Superior? Man, it’s your choice where you want to be. Don’t give me that “I can’t do it cause of the white man, or I don’t know anybody, or no one will give me a break.” I don’t buy it. I served with guys in the military who said they were in only because of the GI Bill. Said it was the only way they could afford college. I would tell them, you must not want college very much.
I worked 40+ hours a week to pay my way thru college. 3.65 GPA, doing well. My choice.
Give the poor and entire week off? You missed the point. IF US RICH PEOPLE take off for 3 months, this government goes broke. WHY? Cause we fund the government, the social programs, hospitals etc. So if you want to give the poor a day off, go ahead. The democrats and liberals don’t care, cause in the grand scheme of things, they don’t pay much in taxes.
And ‘we poor people’ paying for the war in Iraq? If you pay less than 10% of the taxes, how do you figure that. I’d love to see your logic on that one.
Peasant revolutions? You do know that ‘we’ now pay more in taxes to the US Govt, per capita tax payer, than what the British wanted prior to the revolutionary war.
With the mindset of our current ‘peasants’, we would end up with a socialist government. Yes, a lovely marxist society. With the best medical care, living conditions, roads, infrastructure and quality of life in the world. Oh wait,,,didn’t the Soviet Union try that? And Cuba,,what a paradise that is? And who wouldn’t want to live in China? I think the ‘poor working’ people would balk on that one big time.
How about we have a society where anyone can become anything they want, but they have to be willing to work for it.
Jo-
I agree with you that there are tons of poor people that are simply too lazy or unwilling to work. Some of my rant was based on emotions and not facts. However, I still believe that connections and influence play a bigger role for the majority of the rich than they have for you.
I apologize to you that my statements sounded like an attack, I did not mean them that way, and as I stated above, I was letting my emotions get the better of me on some points.
Even so, I did not say that you are not entitled to your money. I in fact said that you are entitled to your money.
As to the idea of the rich picking up the larger amount of the tax burden, my arguement is that the rich use more resources simply because they own more assets, possess more, etc. A buisiness owner that ships products across the country uses the roads (provided with tax dollars) far more than you or I do. Why should this person not pay a larger amount to maintain those roads? This is just a simplified example of course, and it could easily be argued that since there are more poor people in the nation, they should pay more, because as a group they use more. That is not my arguement, but I guess you could say it.
The poor getting the week off thing maybe was too reactionary. However, I have no sympathy for someone who works 70 hours a week and then complains about it. You say that it was your choice, so deal with it. As for the taxes, who the hell is going to pay for all these wonderful roads, schools, foreign invasions, etc. etc. etc. You note that the poor pay less than 10% of the taxes. Well you figure it out. How could someone who barely makes enough to survive as it is continue to work and pay more in taxes? Wouldn’t that put them in a worse situation than before?
Oh, I know, work harder, make more money. Well by doing that, they wouldn’t be poor anymore though, so they would qualify to pay less in taxes right (in the ideal system)? How about a flat tax? Would that work for you? Everybody pay 15%. Obviously the rich still pay more per person, but it would be the same percentage across the board. I’d be willing to go with that no matter where I ended up (through my own hard work). I wouldn’t like the sting of losing the money no doubt, but not paying for things like roads and such…
I agree with you on the society where anyone can become anything they want. I even agree with the working for it part. However, I do not believe that we have reached that point. A Meritocracy would be grand, and force everyone to pull there own weight. Even so, there would still be some that would be unable (disabled, mentally handicapped, etc.) How would these folks fit into the situation? And where would government play a role (or would this be a lazes faire sort of thing? Those always seem to work out, just like communism, right?)
Peasant Revolutions though. I don’t think that the current peasants would necesarily turn us into a marxist society. Not every poor person is just looking for a handout. There are a lot of idiots and lazy ass people out there, true, but there are also a lot of people working full time to bring home a meager paycheck as well. Maybe I’m just looking at things too simplistically here, and perhaps the arguement/warning of peasant revolutions is not appropriate since you probably have as much political power as I do. Then again, I see our society as class based as any in the past have been, so maybe there is some validity to my thought as well.
But, I’m not so sure that the American Revolution was what I was referring to when I said Peasant Revolutions. After all, it was lead by some rather affluent men that wanted to be free of taxation to the British Empire. Peasants were merely pawns in the matter, and I’d be willing to bet that most ‘peasants’ of the time felt little change from British to American rule. Perhaps they felt a little less secure, but not much else. Joe Minuteman saw little change between British tyranny and American rule in his day to day life most likely. The ones that saw the real differences were the ruling class.
Okay, I apologize for having upset you Jo (And for not having answered your responses in the order that you gave them). I am not a lazy person myself, I have just been through a bad year and a half on the job market. I admit I let emotion play a big role in that above statement (as I said, sorry to keep beating a dead horse here.)
One last thing though, you tell me not to give you the
Terry,
No problems. I get emotional about somethings too. Sometimes I sound like an arrogant, ‘I’m better than you’ ass. (wife tells me that all the time). And in no way do I mean to slight the poorer people of this country. I’ve been there.
Flat tax: I squarely believe in the flat tax. It’s equal and fair to ALL Americans. However, I do believe their should be a threshold. “If you don’t make $XXX you don’t pay taxes.” $20k a year for example.
Use Tax: We already have that. There are road surcharges, fees, license fees and taxes lumped on to businesses already. And you know who pays those taxes? We do, with the increased price of goods.
Gotta run now. Will finish later.
“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and
religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the
government of any other.”
“Public virtue cannot exist in a nation without
private virtue, and public virtue is the only foundation
of republics.”
……John Adams
Thanks Brandi…isn’t it amazing what a person can find when they do some fact checking? Go figure.
Just a couple of things, then I will happily piss-off back to whatever router I crawled out from:
1. Speculative Freemasonry built this country, google about a bit on the phrase ‘Nature’s God’.
2. Joe McCarthy was a dog. J. Edgar Hoover’s dog.
3. Communist infiltration for purposes of exporting Communism was first published as a definite agenda of the Comitern by Lenin, and was only dropped by Stalin at the behest of ‘allies’ during WWII.
4. Communist, Democrat, Liberal … whatever. We all have to live here and breathe the same air, these damn labels do not mean a thing … they are only reasons for persecuting more people who probably do not have anything to do with the actual problems.
5. There should only be two divisons in mankind: US and THE BANKERS. The bankers are behind it all, everything bad is the fault of people who play fast and loose with economic principles. I know because I played Illuminati until all I could handle doing anymore was sitting in front of blogs and posting meaningless carp on top of meaningless carp.
My cat’s breath smells like cat food …
More of John Adams
The cross represents Christianity.
I don’t know what most of these posts have to do with Ann Coulter. There are plenty of personal attacks on her but nobody is discussing the facts contained in “treason”. With new information becoming public, old myths are being disproven. Her book discusses this, as do many others out there. The liberal reaction to this book is along the lines of someone trying to convince everyone the world is flat.
Well RJ,
If you believe the “facts” in Treason then it would be pointless to try to refute them, you can’t be reasoned with. If you think that the big bad liberals (of which I proudly and loudly proclaim myself as one) are traitors who hate America how can anyone get through to you? Obviously we vile traitors would only lie to defend our position so why would you listen to us?
Well I have to go skewer and roast a baby to eat and pray to my dark lord satan. He thinks Bill O’Reilly is a hoot.
I haven’t read Ann’s book “Treason”, and I’ve done no research on McCarthy. I do know that part of the Soviet Communist agenda was to enforce the communist system on unwilling and unknowing people thru subversion and secrecy. However, AC’s tirades against liberals strike me as being ironic. She thinks that by calling for Americans to be attacked and killed, she becomes a great patriot? I guess the Unabomber was one hell of an American. He didn’t write witty articles and books to encite others to violence, but he had the balls to just start killing people himself. If Ann Coulter really believes in her views so strongly, why doesn’t she do just that? Maybe she just isn’t as “patriotic” as Ted Kczynski.
Bless Ann Coulter, maybe she just needs to get out more. Does anyone know the economic effects of McCarthyism in the USA? Economics in Hollywood? nice one!
Well I think Joe McCarthy had good intentions at first but he began to be a real jerk about it. Then it all went to his head. I mean how could it not with the nod of your head you could be condemned. So he started to abuse his power. He might have been a hero in the beginning but definately not the ending product that was a power hungry man and I think that Mrs. Ann Coulter is a great hag for defending that side of him.
my dad is “hard” over kicking sadaams ass too!
but, i think it might be because he quit school in the 9th grade.
I notice the same patterning of “fools logic” (lyus pyritus, keekee!) in some of the above posts:
1. Either/Or Fallacy – if people really could understand how simpleton this type of logic is, they would feel extremely dumb. “You are either with us or you are with the terrorists”.
“you either support our imperialist agenda, or you are with the “Pierres”” (this means french, dad!).
the problem is that people really believe or can only conceive two different viewpoints. this creates a falsely dichotimous situation where we are forced to ascribe to one solution or the other, completely ignoring the better solution that has not been included into the rationale.
i suppose that most of the people in this country got smarts real good, but havent had the most basic level of logic in school. i suppose that is why people are so willing to swallow shit, as long as it has a spoonfull of sugar with it. listen to how our leaders skirt logic when they speak, “the cia has learned from brittish intelligence that iraq has tried to purchase significant amounts of enriched uranium form africa”.
or ronald dumsfeld’s current foot in mouth winnner,
“We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns—the ones we don’t know we don’t know.”
vrrrrrp!
listen to the state of the union address and find all of the ‘logical outs’ there are in it. “Could produce” “May have”. the list goes on and on. there is no other way to say it, they are creating deception…
the bottom line is that we are fools to let them skirt language and serve something as a threat even though it “may” not have been. now the sheople, like my dad are saying that sadaam lied to us about having weapons. its like 6 year old trying to lie to his mother about something he did, when the first excuse breaks down, on to plan b, c, d, e or f.
people are too afraid or they have too much invested to just say, “hey, i fucked up!”, i got kind of caught up in the buildup of unabashed jingoism to think about it. “i was for a short time a nazi, and for this i appologize. i am better now”.
instead we are left with sadaam was a bad guy… i guess you cant really argue with that.
perhaps we shouldnt have got all chummy with him in the 80’s.
hindsight is a bitch!
2. Appeal to Fear/Emotion. “Are you going to let a bully punch u in the ass and steal your lunch money”. my dad likes to say, “are you gonna let sadaam kick you when your down?” (i should add that he is one of the 50% of the sheople who believes iraq is responsible for 9-11).
i am for gun rights, but i have noticed a lot of gun nuts using the same rationale, “are you going to let the boogieman into your house and watch him butcher and rape yer wife and kids?”. in stats we call this a low-base rate phenomenon, meaning that you have lotto type odds of this happening, and that preparing for such phenomena is futile…
i think that as citizens of this country, there is really no place in the world where the people’s fears are used and amplified in order to make us complicit and to make us consume… “tweaking the fear knob” as it were.
3. improper comparison, “all rag-heads want death to the infidels”.
fundamentalism exists in all walks, if you think that all muslims want death to the infidels, then perhaps you should do a little research on islam. look throughout history, islam has been around for what 1300 years or so (thats an estimate).
which religion in that time has commmited the greatest attrocities in the name of their particular idol?
has much really changed as far as islam goes? or has the geo-political climate changed?
4. ad homenem abusive. “Liberal” this and “Liberal” that. i saw a simpsons recently where they were parodying fox news with a newscrawl that said, “Democrats known to cause cancer”.
if that doesnt nail it i dont know what does. It is funny to be what would be considered removed from the current partison crapfeast (that is leading to the next election). you watch these idiots try to blame everything on each other, and then you watch their corresponding sheepsiz parrot the same line. when in actuallity they are all responsible for the space in which we currently find our country.
The democrats stood up and applauded the president’s state of the union address. they gave him a pass without even the mildest of debates. they gave him the war powers act (which basically amounts to a dictaroship). they were complicit in every way. btw, they got us fired up for vietnam too!
as long as we let the inmates run the assylum, we will have to deal with getting feces thrown in our faces everytime we turnaround in the rec yard.
5. An eye for an eye… profoundly religious people have actually used this quite a bit to justify their aggression.
the funny thing is that it really doesnt say anything like this in the bible as it pertains to interpersonal relationships or governments or anything like that.
in fact jesus was a liberal of grand proportions (kindness and acceptance being the mantra). this fact only seems to anger my dad, who likes to pick and choose his allegiances to christianity (he also seems to think that as long as he does the symbolic stuff like pray and label himself a christian hes going to “heaven”). i would think that if that entire chiritanity thing is correct, then it would be a person’s jesus like attributes that would get them into the “pearly gates” and not some symbolic crap, unless this god they speak of is just a total dumbshit like the rest of us (hehe).
the logical equation this philosophy creates has been proven to not have a solution over time (division by zero), considering there have been hatfields and mccoys throughout history who only fight because they have a legacy of fighting, and any semblance of who killed first has been long digested, crapped out, broken down by microorganisms who were eaten by more complex organisms who were in turn eaten by pregnant hatfields, only to fortify a new meat shield for the “Cause”.
what was i talking about again?
oh yeah, this ann coulter woman who is an obvious marty kroft creation gone terribly awry…
she would justify anything for the neo-cons. if the neo-cons decided they were going to take all of the poor and kill their first born, she would be on fox news trying to justify it…..
hoo-ray for our side (of sides)!!!!!!!!!!?!!
by the way i dont mean to hurt anyones feelings. i simply call it like i see it…
i have great respect for anyone with the cohonees to post their beliefs, this is what makes our country great.
Truthfully Yours.
The Hallucinating One
“If you believe the facts, you can’t refute them”
Well, I guess all of civilization back to the Greeks has been wrong. It really is not possible to have a debate.
Just tell me which of these are wrong:
Alger Hiss was a communist spy.
The Rosenbergs were communists spys.
Krushchev thanked the Rosenbergs for their help in creating the soviet bomb.
The 57 communists named in the wheeling speech were indeed communists.
The famous Welch rebuff about McCarthy’s decency came after much sarcastic harranging by Welch and McCarthy’s lack of decency was for “outing” a “lad” that had already been “outed” (and I really want to know about this . . .I looked for transcripts of that session, but I could not find them)
Communist sympathizers in the state department were involved in policies that gave up the eastern block to the Soviets and lost China.
You can agree or disagree. You can tell me that communism is OK, (though you have to explain the 20 million people murdered by Stalin).
But don’t tell me you can’t find fault with some of these major points while maintaining your attacks on Ms. Coulter.
[snip]
“Even Islamic terrorists don’t hate America like liberals do.”
“[T]he left is itching to silence conservatives once and for all.”
“[I]f Americans knew what they [liberals] really believed, the public would boil them in oil.”
““Principle is nothing to liberals. Winning is everything.”
“[A]lmost all serious debate takes place exclusively among conservatives.”
“[C]onservatives in America are the most tolerant (and long-suffering) people in America.”
“[W]hen right-wingers rant, there’s at least a point: There are substantive arguments contained in conservative name-calling.”
[snip]
Coulter quotes snipped from Spinsanity. Oh yeah, she’s rational and unbiased, alright. . . if you’re a loon!
Coulter thinking runs along the lines of:
Some Communists were spies. Therefore all Communists should have been persecuted. Hell, I’m glad they went after Socialists and organized labor too. and Atheists. I think they should’ve bombed the Atheists and coverted them to Xianity.
Some Muslims commited a terrorist attack against America. Therefore all Muslims should be persecuted. Hell, let’s go after anyone who even *looks* like they might be Muslim. Let’s start lynching liberals too, as they’re practically traitors. . . And let’s bomb all Muslim countries and convert them to Xianity.
[snip: End Coulter thought—and breathe huge sigh of relief]
It’s a dangerous lapse in logic to think (just because Coulter has some of her facts right) that the conclusions she draws are somehow rational. McCarthy was an “OK guy.” Give me a break. There have always been spies leaking info to rival nations—some spies are motivated by money, some by ideology, but it’s the job of our CIA and FBI to root these people out and minimize the damage that they do. McCarthy, on the other hand, (and he wasn’t solely responsible for this by any means. HUAC was there for the kickoff, and ran for plenty of yardage on their own) helped to create an environment in which people lost their jobs, or had their writings suppressed, or had to self-censor, just so that dangerous IDEAS wouldn’t circulate. That’s completely anti-American. It’s the type of thinking that’s behind the Patriot Act—ie: it doesn’t matter how many innocents we harm, as long as we’re really *trying* to get “the bad guys.” The American Communist party had about 75 thousand members after WWII, but that number dwindled to less than ten thousand by 1957.(Navasky 1) There were plenty of other “left leaning” people, as well, who never belonged to the Communist party, but considered themselves Socialists, or just liberals. (The right tends to dismiss the distinction, but that’s OK, as I’m convinced that the distinction between “Right” and “Nazi” is mere semantics—see, I can be a complete loon too! Maybe there’s a book deal waiting for me!) That number of people didn’t fall away from the Communist party because they lost faith with Communist ideals, they fell away from the ACP because membership was dangerous to their personal welfare. What we’re talking about is an entire political movement being crushed by the power of the existing govt. The question isn’t whether or not the 57 people in the Wheeling report were Communists, but whether their Communism was a threat to the US. As for America “losing” China and the Eastern bloc—did we also “lose” all the socialistic countries in Europe? There’s plenty of industrial countries that don’t have privatized health care—clearly they are a threat to the American way of life. The assumption that unrestricted capitalism and corporately ruled government are the proper destiny of every country on the planet is pure hubris. China and the Eastern bloc aren’t “ours” to have. Nor are any of the little South American or Middle Eastern countries where we’ve been mucking about, all in an attempt to make the world safe for US style Capitalism. Yes, Stalin slaughtered millions to impose his vision on Russia, but if you’re going to lay that at the doorstep of Communism, I’ve got a few “Capitalism” related genocides we can bring up. Manifest Destiny is just a euphemism for “steal everything that ain’t nailed down.”
That being said:
I guarantee that there are, at this very moment, terrorists in this country actively plotting to blow some shit up (and probably some people too, unfortunately). I think that anyone who doesn’t believe this is probably living in dreamland. But anyone who then leaps from this conclusion to the assertion that all people who oppose the war in Iraq are “traitors,” or that we should immediately remove anyone who is Muslim from their govt. position, prevent anyone who is Muslim from publishing their poetry, and incarcerate and interrogate anyone who questions American support for Israel, is clearly a loon. And this is precisely the sort of logic that Coulter is engaging in. On the other hand, we probably *should* try to interrogate, at least briefly, family members of the guy who claimed responsibility for 9-11. I mean, if we’re willing to seize Canadian citizens and ship them to Syria to be tortured, you’d think we’d have the hutzpah to at least question the Bin Laden family. But maybe not.
And finally, (if you’ve made it this far, let me apologise profusely for putting you through this!)
Is McCarthy the anti-Christ that some liberals would hold him up to be? No. No more than Michael Moore is the savior that some liberals would hold him up to be. But McCarthy WAS without question a dangerous demagogue (not unlike Coulter herself), and as such he is a likely pivot upon which to hang liberal anxieties about govt. repression.
My ultimate point, however, is that Coulter herself (despite the fact that her book contains *some* factual content) routinely distorts the truth. And I’m not going to actually bother to cite those distortions here, unless you actually insist upon it. It would be easy enough for you to see the kinds of misrepresentations that she engages in by merely visiting Spinsanity. I think their approach is rather even handed.
1. Navasky http://www.english.upenn.edu/~afilreis/50s/navasky-social-costs.html
What I wrote : If you believe the
nowiser—
>>Coulter quotes snipped from Spinsanity. Oh yeah, she
Mr. B.
1) You are clearly very invested in defending Mc Carthy from the scurrilous charges leveled against him. I wish you luck. I on the other hand, am simply offended by Coulter’s libelous misrepresentations of liberalism. Granted, this thread, specifically, is about Coulter
Oh, if it helps, anyone who is still really interested in this debate might want to check out
http://www.americasdebate.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3981&st=75
They have been going around on this particular issue for quite some time, and seem somewhat invested in it.
All I can add to the above post by Nowiser is that if you are interested in seeking facts and finding the truth then look to a more reputable author than Ann Coulter. But if you are here trying to tell us that Ann Coulter gets some facts right, therefore Ann Coulter speaks the truth, thus all liberals are traitors to their country then you are barking up the wrong tree. If you are not here to defend Ann then there are many other places on the web and several other books dealing with McCarthyism, Communism, and the great Red scare.
I’m sorry, but didn;t she do porn at one point?
She looks realy familiar…
I’m sorry, but didn;t she do porn at one point?
She looks realy familiar…
I find it rather amusing through all this bickering about What “McCarthy” was or wasn’t & why.
Then the list of FOX reporters, “Hannity & Colmes”
“OReilly”, list of “known” and self described “terrorist groups” such as “Hamas, Al Qaida, Hizballah, Yada Yada there are approx. 80 others” then there’s a list of Christian terrorist and yes they ARE terrorist regardless of how you try and cloud the definition “Eric Rudolph and Tim McViegh” there is actually a pretty long list 3 of which have been “honored” to be on the FBI’s 10 most wanted list along with other *non-terrorist* like Bin Laden etc.
Here is your *non-terrorist* Christians here though seems to me they are fully aware they are in fact terrorist and proud of it.
http://www.armyofgod.com/MatthewKachinis.html
I see The Inquisition, The Crusades, I believe were mentioned.
Then there’s Nazis/Hitler & the comparisons between pre-war Germany buying into the Nazi propaganda machine about “Ethnic Cleansing” for the betterment of the Aryan race, and Christian Fundamentalist/Terrorist, American Taliban in the USA with their OBVIOUS agenda of not just ethnic cleansing, but also sexual cleansing, moral cleansing, hell everything NON Christian cleansing in a nutshell.
This comparison is quite close, the ONLY difference between them is the USA does not YET have our Hitler counterpart as President AKA “Pat Adolf Robertson” *shudder*
Fact is as you can clearly see from various polls the majority of the USA is already heavily leaning towards this Christian terrorist propaganda machine since by far the majority of the USA is already “indoctrinated” and brainwashed into this insane view of the world around them, so all we would need would be some very charismatic, powerful public speaker, lunatic fringe Christian fanatic to lie,cheat & steal his way into the oval office and I guarantee all the good little “true Christians” would line right up and Goose step & Zeig Heil their way into whatever atrocity this lunatic would lead them into doing, and all they would to say for themselves afterward would be god loves you, & Amen.
Not sure but seems to me that Germans were not already so heavily leaning toward Hitler’s ideology prior to him gaining political power, Americans are quite obvious leaning very heavily towards fundamentalist Christian propaganda and have been for years. (Im sure Elwed will shed light on that)
This EXACT same thing has happened throughout human history, & history repeats itself mainly because of one reason.
There is one underlying reason or cause of everything all of you have listed here.
Hint: it doesn’t have a thing to do with whether your Liberal, Democratic, republican, conservative, libertarian, conservative democrat, liberal republican or any other useless political label one tries to place on another as a way to be divisive.
Fact is none of that really means shit, especially on a Global or entire human race scale of things.
I assure you Hamas or Bin Laden or Rudolf/McVeigh, etc. the list goes on could absolutely careless WTF your pissy little political label you put yourself under is.
ALL these lunatics care about is ONE thing and ONE thing only, and that is what in their diseased brainwashed little mind is “What does GOD want me to do” “What does their religion DEMAND they do” “What does my religious dogma insist be done” .
In the case of Hitler “How can I USE Christianity as the brainwashing propaganda tool it is”.
If you think some little liberal/Democrat/Republican moniker means jack fucking shit to anyone other than whatever lying POS politician your particular affiliation might vote for then your dreaming.
All this hatred, racism, intolerance, on a global scale for centuries have only ONE common denominator RELIGION.
2/3rds of this planets people are in one way or another governed by whatever fictitious God they blindly follow.
Such pure hatred & unbridled cruelty upon fellow human beings such as Genocide can only be attributed to one human frailty, RELIGION.
ONLY in RELIGION do you find “Justifications” for such brutality, human beings are not born with this hatred towards their fellow man, they are proselytized into this hatred through religious indoctrination.
Liberals/Democrats do not ordinarily kill Republicans though they may at times feel the urge to do so, but there is no holy scripture, some Fable, parable, or fairytale for them to fall back on as “Justification” ordained by God for such an action, least not because of the person being merely Liberal or republican.
If this was so then I might tune into CNN senate proceedings to watch the carnage.
I can already hear the mumblings of David saying “Oh they are not True Christians” or some average Muslim saying “Oh no that’s not what Islam teaches”..Got a one word answer to that BULLSHIT.
Religion “teaches” whatever some nutcase gleans from it.
I absolutely assure you that Tim McVeigh or Eric Rudolf, or Pat Adolf Robertson, Jim Jones, Jerry Eichmann Falwell, Randall Terry, Ossma Bin Laden, every nut strapping a bomb around their waist today, every freak that lit every bonfire to burn a witch, every lunatic that participated in every Genocide, ALL fully “believe” that they are a “True Christian” or “True Muslim” etc.
So how can this be? simple.
What you have in religion is nothing but a “Faith” based entirely on nothing but a “Belief”
In Christianity you have approx. 2 Billion people that all believe their little sect to be the only “true” version, many of which will fight to the death to advance it, you have many versions of the same Book, you have something like 22,000 different Christian sects/denominations.
Each “Christian” from whatever sect that picks up whatever version of whatever Bible is going to interpret it differently than the next and so on.
The reason of this is because you have individuals that are brainwashed into obsession over a “belief” in something THAT DOESN’T FUCKING EXIST IN REALITY.
Something of which there is absolutely ZERO Falsifiable proof of, something that can be interpreted to mean whatever the hell your little pee brain wants it to mean.
If your base intellect is so low that you fully 100% believe the Earth is only 6000 years old, Noah’s flood, some fictitious being spoke a few words and poof here we are and so on.
Then you are liable to fall for ANYTHING, you can be easily led to believe any lunatics insane babblings no matter how far fetched they may seem.
All they or you have to do is interpret whatever parable in the Bible or Koran to mean whatever the hell you want it to, then your actions no matter how insane or brutal are completely justified BY GOD.
So your little Crusade or inquisition or Jihad is all ordained by god, your doing nothing but “Gods Work” you have no remorse actually the more you kill the better you feel, the closer you are to God. WooHoo, throw another witch on the fire boys going to be a long cold night in gods country.
Religion breeds hatred, demands intolerance, preaches racism, condones genocide, justifies any atrocity in the name of god.
It is by far the most divisive & destructive tool humans have at their disposal and its all in the mind.
That sounds perfectly logical and pretty much what I had thought.
The odds of the USA at this point turning into a totalitarian Theocracy are 100% unless we can start turning the tide of ignorance in this country.
Christians are losing approx. 1% to their ranks every year since 86 but it appears though as more solid valid information comes to light proving that Evolution is more than just theory and massive doubts on the existence of God that for every 1% that depart the fold there are about 1% that turn deeper into the lunacy and become Fundamentalist loony tunes.
We desperately need another Scopes trial nationally televised and a good one.
We must fight back this wave of insanity that’s sweeping this country under the guise of Christianity.
If Christians gain total control of the strongest country on Earth they will not hesitate a split second to squash every nation that stands in its way to proselytize the world and their age old arch enemies the Muslims are top of that list.
Imagine if you will the 21st century Crusades but fought with current weapons instead of swords & rocks. It will not be a pretty sight.
It will all be fully justified by God of course and they will feel no remorse just another day of Gods work, Amen.
This idea just now came to me, its no freaking wonder no peace talks or any diplomacy rarely works since all involved are usually a bunch of religious zealots on both sides, neither is ever going to listen to the other as their religious agendas will always get in the way.
That’s a bit too absolute a position. However, once a theocracy gains traction, it’s extremely hard to oppose secular and religious prejudice combined. In hindsight, it’s always easy to determine the point of no return…
Thanks, nunyabiz. You pretty much summed it up.
To get back to the original question, one thing Anne Coulter (and everybody else) seems to leave out, is a basic, medical fact. Senator McCarthy was half drunk by noon, dead drunk by eight pm, every day of
his elected office. He drank himself to death.
Damn those Commie Pinkoes, they drove him to it!
What do you future theocrats think o’ that?
might be a tad absolute I guess but we are so close to a full blown Theocracy already that its scary.
I hope it doesn’t happen in my lifetime but Im not very optimistic, hate to see this country go down the tubes buts its well on its way right now if we cant loosen this death grip the religious right has over it.
This pretty much sums it up, although I disagree with his statement that “The Christian right is not a violent group of people”
There is in fact a very large percentage of that Christian Right that is Violent.
Just look at all the 100s & 100s of “Christian based hate groups” abortion clinic bombings, Gay bashing, etc.
http://www.knightsofenlightenment.net/Religion.html
The Christian Right Fundamentalist/Terrorist are easily the biggest threat to American sovereignty today.
Number one its largely these nutcases in high office be it The President, or Senate, Congress, and right down to military officials that have placed the USA on the chopping block of world opinion in the first place.
So while these Christian Fundamentalist are getting the rest of the world to hate us, they are chipping away from within to completely take over the country with their Totalitarian Theocratic rule.
I see no way of stopping it either unless the vast majority of citizens snap out of this religious stupor and realize & face religion for exactly what it is….BULLSHIT!
Bah left out the other site i was going to list.
http://www.counterpunch.org/cook10272003.html
Ever since David mentioned absolute morals, there is something I wanted to quote:
This is from “The Parafaith War” by L.E.Modesitt, Jr. – a science fiction novel. When you think about it, this is near-perfect summary of the Third Reich and other totalitarian regimes.
I suppose there is a very dangerous breed of people that try to force their own narcissm on others, using the bludgeon of absolute moral values.